Tail protection from "limber tail"

torrentduck · Dec 16, 2015

Anyone use any type of wrap, blanket, neoprene, etc. specifically around dogs tail base/hind quarters? My girl wears a vest, but is prone to cold tail. Other than drying her off between retrieves and covering her up when she is lying in blind I have not been able to predict or prevent recurrence. She does receive Boswellia orally a preventative. So..... a strange question I guess, but anyone know of any type of cover for a dog's bum? Guess I could cut some neoprene tail glove out of old wet suit material that I pop off when she is working?
Thanks.

Peter Balzer · Dec 16, 2015

The best remedy for cold tail is a better conditioned dog and a well fitting neoprene vest.

If you continually have trouble with cold tail your dog is likely not in shape.

torrentduck · Dec 16, 2015

Nice sharp not so useful response. She is in extremely excellent shape. There are many posts on this forum about limber tail occurring in many many many very in shape dogs. She is also well fitted in her vest. But you see.... doesn't really cover her tail or bung-hole. Just looking for novel approaches at protecting that area outside of drying after each retrieve. So.......any useful responses are welcome. Otherwise.......no thanks and have a nice day.

dogluvah · Dec 16, 2015

The response about dog being properly conditioned actually is on target. Despite the fact that the condition is sometimes called "cold tail" it is NOT caused by cold temperatures. It is a muscle strain. It has been noted that once a dog has been affected, that dog is more likely to have a recurrence. Seems you are following the recommended precautions that some dog owners have claimed to have success with. Really....other than restricting the amount of time the dog is using his tail muscles - for balance while running, steering while swimming, pointing while hunting, or wagging when excited - there is not much else you can do

This link explains pathophysiology
http://www.pethealthnetwork.com/dog...g-health/dog-diseases-conditions-a-z/limber-tail-syndrome-why-my-dogs-tail-limp

HoHum's Retrievers · Dec 16, 2015

I know it's called "cold tail," but I am not so certain this condition is caused so much by the temperature but by exertion. One of my good friends and training partners had one of his dogs come down with "cold tail" two years ago after the 4th of July weekend. It was plenty warm obviously. The friend has a lake cabin and the dog had spent three days in and out of the lake and had done a lot more swimming than he was accustomed to. I think it took about two weeks for his tail to come back to normal. That experience leads me to believe the condition is more a result of exertion rather than temperature.

I could believe that it got its name as it comes up during the fall months when temps drop and we are out duck hunting. Probably not so far fetched to say that many more retrieves during the duck season happen in the water than on land and dogs are doing a lot more swimming than they do the rest of the year. You may religiously do a water series or two every time you train during the summer, but that is a lot different than being out in the duck blind day after day making 6, 12, or more retrieves one right after another. Their tails are working more than usual and are also meeting a lot more resistance in the water than the tail would see during the summer training season. I suppose the temp could be part of the problem, just like football players may suffer more muscle and ligament injuries during a game played in December or January than in August or September.

So the suggestion above that your dog's tail may not be conditioned is not necessarily a slam on the overall condition of your dog or a shot at you for taking some old, fat, out of shape dog hunting, but purely a legitimate suggestion at the root cause of your dog's condition. And I would also suggest that perhaps no "tail and bum warming device/vest" would aid in preventing the onset of the condition.

Perhaps someone with better medical knowledge or life experience can chime in. I am just speculating here. Please correct me if I am wrong. I have never had a dog with this issue, but I have goldens and their tails are always working in overdrive because their lives are so absolutely positive all the time. (Before you crucify me, that wasn't a slam against all of you non-golden owners that your dogs are mistreated and also don't have terribly happy lives)

Longgun · Dec 16, 2015

What about a S.U.G.A.R. coat. It covers their whole body while out of the water.
deb

Peter Balzer · Dec 16, 2015

Here's the best information that I've seen online RE: cold/limber tail.

http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/limbertail-update704.html

Sorry you didn't care for my response, but in general my was answer was on point.

Peter Balzer · Dec 16, 2015

Longgun said:
What about a S.U.G.A.R. coat. It covers their whole body while out of the water.
deb

The S.U.G.A.R. coat would not protect/affect the strain on the dog's tail muscles unless its restricts its movement and that may not be the best either.

Don Lietzau · Dec 16, 2015

What about cutting the tail off? My Drahthaars have never had "cold tail" and we hunt and swim in Alaskan conditions. Come to think of it, neither has my Lab/Rotti.......she has a long tail. Humm......
Don and Crew

torrentduck · Dec 16, 2015

Don Lietzau said:
What about cutting the tail off? My Drahthaars have never had "cold tail" and we hunt and swim in Alaskan conditions. Come to think of it, neither has my Lab/Rotti.......she has a long tail. Humm......
Don and Crew

Tried that......it grew back. Line crossed wth a lizard somwhere in the past.

Daren Galloway · Dec 16, 2015

torrentduck said:
Anyone use any type of wrap, blanket, neoprene, etc. specifically around dogs tail base/hind quarters? My girl wears a vest, but is prone to cold tail. Other than drying her off between retrieves and covering her up when she is lying in blind I have not been able to predict or prevent recurrence. She does receive Boswellia orally a preventative. So..... a strange question I guess, but anyone know of any type of cover for a dog's bum? Guess I could cut some neoprene tail glove out of old wet suit material that I pop off when she is working?
Thanks.

Does your dog constantly shake with the vest on? In another related post I commented that the only time my dog has gotten it was when I let him run around while picking up decoys with his vest on. I thought it would warm him up more (3 degrees at sunrise), but after he got limber tail and I did some research I found excessive shaking can contribute/cause it, he doesn't like the vest so when he is running free, not on a retrieve or in the blind, he shakes constantly trying to get it off. I believe that is what caused it for him, as there was almost no swimming that day just splash water, and he has hunted in worse conditions, in the same body condition, and not gotten it, as soon as we're done hunting I take the vest off.

torrentduck · Dec 16, 2015

HoHum's Retrievers said:
I know it's called "cold tail," but I am not so certain this condition is caused so much by the temperature but by exertion. One of my good friends and training partners had one of his dogs come down with "cold tail" two years ago after the 4th of July weekend. It was plenty warm obviously. The friend has a lake cabin and the dog had spent three days in and out of the lake and had done a lot more swimming than he was accustomed to. I think it took about two weeks for his tail to come back to normal. That experience leads me to believe the condition is more a result of exertion rather than temperature.

I could believe that it got its name as it comes up during the fall months when temps drop and we are out duck hunting. Probably not so far fetched to say that many more retrieves during the duck season happen in the water than on land and dogs are doing a lot more swimming than they do the rest of the year. You may religiously do a water series or two every time you train during the summer, but that is a lot different than being out in the duck blind day after day making 6, 12, or more retrieves one right after another. Their tails are working more than usual and are also meeting a lot more resistance in the water than the tail would see during the summer training season. I suppose the temp could be part of the problem, just like football players may suffer more muscle and ligament injuries during a game played in December or January than in August or September.

So the suggestion above that your dog's tail may not be conditioned is not necessarily a slam on the overall condition of your dog or a shot at you for taking some old, fat, out of shape dog hunting, but purely a legitimate suggestion at the root cause of your dog's condition. And I would also suggest that perhaps no "tail and bum warming device/vest" would aid in preventing the onset of the condition.

Perhaps someone with better medical knowledge or life experience can chime in. I am just speculating here. Please correct me if I am wrong. I have never had a dog with this issue, but I have goldens and their tails are always working in overdrive because their lives are so absolutely positive all the time. (Before you crucify me, that wasn't a slam against all of you non-golden owners that your dogs are mistreated and also don't have terribly happy lives)

You are correct --- not just caused by cold water. Hence a better name is limber tail, dead tail, limp tail. It is often and maybe always associated with exertion and may be more likely when pushing dog beyond even regular training (i.e. hot full day of hunting birds in fields, multiple long retrieves in water (cold or not). It is similar/analgous to what can be termed, acute rhabdomyositis, acute rhabdomyolosis, capture myopathy (all of which not too uncommon in hoofstock and long legged birds chased or restrained for long time). Not as common in carnivores. Dogs have tight bound muscles in tail and so swelling can result in pain quite easily.

torrentduck · Dec 16, 2015

Daren Galloway said:
Does your dog constantly shake with the vest on? In another related post I commented that the only time my dog has gotten it was when I let him run around while picking up decoys with his vest on. I thought it would warm him up more (3 degrees at sunrise), but after he got limber tail and I did some research I found excessive shaking can contribute/cause it, he doesn't like the vest so when he is running free, not on a retrieve or in the blind, he shakes constantly trying to get it off. I believe that is what caused it for him, as there was almost no swimming that day just splash water, and he has hunted in worse conditions, in the same body condition, and not gotten it, as soon as we're done hunting I take the vest off.

I read your post and thought about that. In an effort to keep here warm overall I give her time to run around between flights (as many have suggested on the forum). Yesterday she spend an inordinate amount of time rubbing against the wall of the blind in effort to dry off the vest. It is possible that in her shaking and tail wagging, she set herself up for another episode. It was slow yesterday.....maybe I should consider popping off the vest in those cases. Thanks.

torrentduck · Dec 18, 2015

Just a little followup for those interested. Still need to work on prevention, but during this bout I used both acupuncture and cold laser. Along with rest, she seemed to respond faster and returned to normal quicker. Only have one event (hopefully no more) to comment on, but if you have those treatment modalities available to you, might want to consider.

David McCracken · Dec 18, 2015

I'm a firm believer in Boswellia as a preventative. We've never had a reoccurrence of cold tail when we've given the Boswellia several days before vigorous exercise was planned (such as hunting trip....waterfowl or upland... that lasts several days). Dose the dog up for 3 days prior to a trip and twice a day during the trip.

Brokengunz · Dec 18, 2015

Wonder if that's why they doc tails off pointers

EdA · Dec 18, 2015

Brokengunz said:
Wonder if that's why they doc tails off pointers

Pointer tails are not docked, indeed part of the classic point is the position of the tail. The only research peer reviewed study done on limber tail was done on Pointers for exactly that reason. For those who allege that limber tail is from a lack of conditioning I can assure them that those Pointers were extremely well conditioned.

gdgnyc · Dec 18, 2015

For the first time my dog developed dead tail this year. It was after spending a day working her at a duck shoot at a preserve where she retrieved over thirty ducks, most of them strongly swimming cripples due to poor shooting. She then was put in a crate for a 3 hour ride home. She is extremely well conditioned so I don't think that was a factor.

I believe that EdA has posted a link to the abstract of his wife's study. It is worth the read.

CodyC · Dec 19, 2015

I don't have any advice on how to stop it however my dog got it once or twice over the past 3 years. Now when we hunt and it's cold, it's almost like he gets it a little bit but not full blown. While on the hunt, he will have trouble sitting down because his tail is hanging low and tucked. I always think he is going to have it but when we are done hunting I let him run and dry him off before I crate him and by the time I get him home his tail has straightened back out again. It's very strange.

dorkweed · Dec 19, 2015

My 5yo CLF has had it more than several times. She got a case of it this year in the crate on the ride up to North Dakota.................12 hours drive time................but with a couple airing breaks of at least 15 minutes each. Once we got up to NoDak, and got the dogs out.................she's got the tail that goes straight out back for a couple inches, and then hangs straight down................she won't wag her tail, and is reluctant to sit.

With her though, it doesn't seem to bother her in the field retrieving or swimming. The first 2 days hunting in NoDak this year, she would just stand on the dog stand, or puppy sit on it. After the first 2 days, she was over it.

I dunno.

Tail protection from "limber tail"

torrentduck

Peter Balzer

torrentduck

dogluvah

HoHum's Retrievers

Longgun

Peter Balzer

Peter Balzer

Don Lietzau

torrentduck

Daren Galloway

torrentduck

torrentduck

torrentduck

David McCracken

Brokengunz

EdA

gdgnyc

CodyC

dorkweed

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