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let's start a new breed - hypothetical

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#21 ·
Lisa Van Loo said:
All breeds of purebred dog have some alleles in common with at least several other breeds. If this were not so, diseases like hip dysplasia and autoimmune hypothyroidism would not be so widespread among breeds. Field, English Cocker, Springer, and American Cocker Spaniels did not get well sorted out until well into the 20th century (American and English Cockers were not separated until the 1940s), for instance. I rather doubt they can be definitively separated out by DNA markers alone.

I wonder if anyone has ever sent in a sample from a purebred just to see what results would come back? Might be fun, but I didn't bother to check the price tag. I would expect a Chessie to have genes in common with Newfoundlands, perhaps some hound breeds, the Boykin, and the NSDTR, for starters. IWS most definitely; I myself have now documented 3 crosses to the IWS that happened just prior to the turn of the 20th century. Evolutionarily, that isn't all that long.

One Born Every Minute Regards;

Lisa
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Lisa, that was my first thought especially with Chessies because of the known mixes and I am certain there are many unknown mixes which occured prior to establishing AKC status....PG
 
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#23 ·
I can tell you one not to try. Lab x English Pointer – ended up with the brains of a Pointer and the nose of a Lab.
 
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Discussion starter · #24 ·
interesting discussion....

I think that it would take a LOT of breeding to get the best of both breeds - you could not expect the best of both worlds in one breeding...but with selective breeding - maybe sometime down the road you would end up with that....

I have always been fascinated by the smaller gundog breeds - NSDTR, IWS, AWS, britts, etc....
I think a smaller dog can live longer and have less joint trouble (arthritis)....

If I was going to 'invent' a breed, it would be a smaller retriever (golden, American lab, or chessie)....One that carried all of the retrieving/hunting/tractablility of it's breed, but that was just smaller....40 lb or so....

Juli
 
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#25 ·
Lisa Van Loo said:
All breeds of purebred dog have some alleles in common with at least several other breeds.
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You shouldn't try that fancy talk around here. While I, being a die hard CSI guy, know what it means... others may not have your superior intellect or my keen knowledge of prime time over-acted television drama.

Heratio could tell you exactly what breeds combined to make a specific dog using the dirt under their toenails and stomach content regards,

SM
 
#26 ·
Shayne Mehringer said:
You shouldn't try that fancy talk around here. While I, being a die hard CSI guy, know what it means... others may not have your superior intellect or my keen knowledge of prime time over-acted television drama.

Heratio could tell you exactly what breeds combined to make a specific dog using the dirt under their toenails and stomach content regards,

SM
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Don't forget the all important black light test....that one always gets the responsible party.....
 
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#27 ·
A patient showed up yesterday with his "lab rat" he has a rat terrier female that got out of the house and "had relations" with the neighbors black lab. The dog is now 25 pounds looks like a minature lab with a bobbed tail. They say she is a great family dog, but they don't hunt, but she sure did look pretty cool and had the lab attitude of lovey dovey
 
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#28 ·
limiman12 said:
A patient showed up yesterday with his "lab rat" he has a rat terrier female that got out of the house and "had relations" with the neighbors black lab. The dog is now 25 pounds looks like a minature lab with a bobbed tail. They say she is a great family dog, but they don't hunt, but she sure did look pretty cool and had the lab attitude of lovey dovey
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reminds me of the time I saw a pomerenian humping on a black lab that was lying on a front porch......I think I was laughing for a few hours after that drive by image.....
 
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#29 ·
Lisa, Yeah. Discovered those sites a few months back (on 'breed specific identification'). Was going to tell you inlight of the recent DNA craze for everything. Apparently, most look for 'junk' chains to determine breed.
(one site stated certain alleles are common in certain breeds only and usually have similar junk chains).
Find it interesting they "ask" for a photo of the dog - (to attach to certificate) - but still cannot wonder if actually used to guess/confirm tests.

Agree about using a 'purebred' to see what shows up. Or better yet, a multi dog sample. IE, since a swap/card is used (opposed to blood sample), take a duo sample on one test - ie use Desi & Gopher by rolling in each dogs mouth.
Or two different 'purebred' dogs. Results may become interesting - you think there is "controversy" on tests now - tehehe!! Best Regards, Charlie
 
#31 ·
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#33 ·
Funniest cross I have ever seen was a male mini poodle with a rottweiler female. She was quite the "hussy" when in heat and after many flustrating attempts by the poodle, she laid on her back and let him have his way with her. (these were a friends dogs, not mine!!) This was witnessed by the owner out his kitchen window, apparently he thought it was funny until they tied!!!! Pups were actually really cute, lots of coat, most had rottie markings.
 
#34 ·
Shayne Mehringer said:
You shouldn't try that fancy talk around here. While I, being a die hard CSI guy, know what it means... others may not have your superior intellect or my keen knowledge of prime time over-acted television drama.

Heratio could tell you exactly what breeds combined to make a specific dog using the dirt under their toenails and stomach content regards,

SM
Click to expand...

Careful, Arkie-boy! Some of us know that the fewer branches your family tree has, the more likely it is that you will be homozygous.

Not That There's Anything Wrong With That Regards;

Lisa
 
#35 ·
sky_view said:
I actually think it would be awesome to have a dog with border collie smarts and athleticsim, but that lacked the border collie 'crazies'...LOL
Juli
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sky_view said:
I have always been fascinated by the smaller gundog breeds - NSDTR, IWS, AWS, britts, etc....
I think a smaller dog can live longer and have less joint trouble (arthritis)....
Juli
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Juli, if you're willing to travel a bit these people may have just the mutt for you.
http://tolliesuk.blogspot.com/2009/01/tollie-puppies-have-arrived.html
Farm collies had a role in the development of the Toller so this doesn't seem to be too much of a stretch, even so, I don't see the point in crossing back to a BC. It doesn't look like there is much to be gained by either breed.
I can see it now: "Tollies, manic and vocal!"

George
 
#36 ·
Whoa that first one looks "different"! :)
 
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Discussion starter · #37 ·
mattoleriver said:
Juli, if you're willing to travel a bit these people may have just the mutt for you.
http://tolliesuk.blogspot.com/2009/01/tollie-puppies-have-arrived.html
Farm collies had a role in the development of the Toller so this doesn't seem to be too much of a stretch, even so, I don't see the point in crossing back to a BC. It doesn't look like there is much to be gained by either breed.
I can see it now: "Tollies, manic and vocal!"

George
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OMG - that dog is hysterical looking.....can't imagine the activity level of that mix! probably more than a little 'crazy'....LOL

Juli
 
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#38 ·
sky_view said:
OMG - that dog is hysterical looking.....can't imagine the activity level of that mix! probably more than a little 'crazy'....LOL

Juli
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Having been around both breeds and as a serious Border Collie fancier. Well, the two are generally about the same in activity level. The hype about Border Collie "crazies" is about the same truth as the hype about field trial dogs being "hyper". It was actually started by Border Collie Rescue and some Border Collie fanciers trying to discourage people from buying them as pets as opposed to working farm dogs. However, they can have an "obsessive" streak towards movement (that varies by dog -some could be fence running, or car chasing, or herding the cats) but so can Shelties and even Goldens so.. It's a lot to do with bloodlines and is not near as common as people will have you believe. in fact, I have knowen people with both field bred Goldens and Border Collies in the same household.. About the same in activity level.

Just like any working breed: needs training and excersize or will become hard to be around and appear to be "crazy".

Coming from someone with a Herding Tested Golden Regards!
 
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