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Training Question / Sloppy Hold During Retrieve

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KRB

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I have a BLF thats almost 9 months old. We have been thru hold, she will do all obediance with bumper in her mouth. I have been doing FF for almost 2 weeks now.

After we do FF in the afternoon we finish up with OB and I usually throw a couple of fun bumpers during and after our OB work. She will grab the bumpers on one end or the other and drop them usually once on the way back. not really like a cigar but not firm in the center like when doing hold or FF.

Is this common and is it something that FF will correct eventually?

Also she still wants to drop the dummy at my feet even after telling her to hold on the end of the retrieve. I usually just pick the bumper up and place back in her mouth and command hold and she does until I take it from her.

Will something just click???
 
#2 ·
It sounds like a good candidate to discontinue marks and fun bumpers until after FF is completed. Once FF is done the mouthing issues should resolve themselves. If the dog does have mouth issues at that point, then you have a tool to deal with it.
 
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#3 ·
If you do fun bumpers then they are fun bumpers.....if you are doing OB and enforcing hold then so be it.....either keep it a fun bumper or don't do it.

Also how is the mouth with birds? Some battles are worth fighting some are not.....dog is excited, having a fun bumper, dog does not remember FF lessons because it is high on the fun bumper.....

Personally I say not a battle worth fighting....

FOM
 
Discussion starter · #4 ·
Thx, I am not really worried about it too much. I mean it looks like crap to me but not a huge deal.

She is solid on birds, no mouth problems that I am aware of.

I have cut her fun bumpers way back since starting FF and only give her a couple a day during OB. I think I will cut out all bumpers until FF is complete.

Thanks for the help :)
 
#5 ·
KRB said:
I have a BLF thats almost 9 months old. We have been thru hold, she will do all obediance with bumper in her mouth. I have been doing FF for almost 2 weeks now.

After we do FF in the afternoon we finish up with OB and I usually throw a couple of fun bumpers during and after our OB work. She will grab the bumpers on one end or the other and drop them usually once on the way back. not really like a cigar but not firm in the center like when doing hold or FF.

Is this common and is it something that FF will correct eventually?

Also she still wants to drop the dummy at my feet even after telling her to hold on the end of the retrieve. I usually just pick the bumper up and place back in her mouth and command hold and she does until I take it from her.

Will something just click???
Click to expand...
Hate to say it KRB, but it's not gonna 'click' unless you have the stug for some tough love. You'll need to "bite the bullet" and apply the pressure. FF is NOT for the fainthearted. Based on your comments, I'd say your dog has you figured out very good.

This is not to say you need to be mean, but your ear pinching isn't getting through to the beast. If she has her way at this point, I can't imagine her going through the 'denial' period with anything on her mind but animosity.. not learning and anxious to get through the process.

They are all different, but that's why we MUST learn to read each one. That said, however, this form of "boot camp" is not fun for either the teacher or the student. But if you aren't impressing on her your displeasure with how she's failing to grasp the idea, she will be laying down on you soon.

Good luck, but don't hesitate to find a good pro or experienced amatuer to give you some assistance, before it gets outa hand, and some real "ouchies" will be needed to get the concept across.

UB
 
#6 ·
i would quit with the fun bumpers the dog enjoys ret. but you need to work on del. My male would actually spit the bumper and spin to a heel ready to go get the next one, then after ff he started with the sloppy mouth like your encoutering, chomping, loose carry and dropping, I cut out the fun bumpers and continued with ff and tied a rope to every type of bumper and duck even a goose and made the dog heel up and down the table commading hold and if he dropped the bumper or duck or goose i applied pressure via the e-collar and it took sometime but it was well worth the effort. PS i had a pro tell me that sloppy mouth was due to the ammout of pressure that i had applied to the dog early in life getting c and d before a or b take it for what its worth my female dog who i handled with different hands has a great mouth and has never given me del problems
 
#7 ·
The only part I'd have a problem with is when she dropped it at your feet"you" picked it up and put it in her mouth. I'd be on that ear to the ground say fetch and make "her" pick it up. Maybe your not that far along yet in FF but like others said stop throwing bumper until your done. I think it's ok to throw marks or FB's as long as you keep your FF standards. They will figure out pretty quick she only has to hold it right on the table and can be sloppy in the field. Like they say "been there done that" learned the hard way!
 
#8 ·
The application of pressure is only good if you have really demonstrated what you want the dog to do. Before adding additional pressure, think through how you have been teaching the dog the appropiate standard of hold. Are you sending mixed signals with the fun bumpers? In my opinion you are. I would discontinue them until you're well into walking fetch. Also, a little trick I learned years ago to help with firming up hold is to have the dog fetch odd weighted items, like a hammer. This forces them really hold the item.

/Paul
 
#9 ·
Gun_Dog2002 said:
The application of pressure is only good if you have really demonstrated what you want the dog to do. Before adding additional pressure, think through how you have been teaching the dog the appropiate standard of hold. Are you sending mixed signals with the fun bumpers? In my opinion you are. I would discontinue them until you're well into walking fetch. Also, a little trick I learned years ago to help with firming up hold is to have the dog fetch odd weighted items, like a hammer. This forces them really hold the item.

/Paul
Click to expand...
The barrel end of a wooden baseball bat works good for this too. Alot heavier on the fat end
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
I am new to all of this however I live close to pro trainer, Eddie Hicks @ Jordon Valley Retreivers. I helped him (Watched Mostly) FF about 7 or 8 dogs a couple weeks back and he really taught me alot in that day about being too soft.

I am taking everyones advice and no longer throwing any bumpers for the next couple of weeks or how ever long it takes.

I am using the FF table and she seems eager to partcipate until she get that first pinch.

I am taking my time, staying patient, I want this to be solid.

After FF last night I had her holding the bumper during about 80% of OB and she never dropped it.

This is too much fun :)
 
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KRB
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