RetrieverTraining.Net - the RTF banner
Cancel
Create thread New Forums

Quick question about trials

Jump to Latest
1 - 20 of 55 Posts
A

agengo02

· Registered
Joined
·
186 Posts
Discussion starter · #1 · (Edited)
Hey guys I don't post much but lurk almost every day. I am curious why mixed breed (mutt, cross breed, hybrid, etc) dogs aren't allowed to compete in field trials and hunt tests. It just seems kind of unfair that just because someone can't afford a pure bred lab (or may not be willing to pay over $500 for a dog) they can't compete with their dog. Maybe I am saying this because I have a lab/weim cross (both parents were pure bred; mom was weim, dad was lab) that is only 8 months old and can definitely pass a junior hunt test.

I also have a gripe about retriever clubs. I contacted the closest one to me and was told that my dog would be laughed at by the other members because they have breeding standards for members.

It just seems kind of ridiculous to me that my retriever cant compete in a hunt test or join a retriever club. :(
 
#3 ·
The original intent of AKC competitions was the for "the improvement of the breeds". At one time a spayed or neutered pure bred dogs could not be awarded a FT title because they could not improve their breed.
Since that time AKC has relaxed the pure breed rule in some venues but not FTs.

Tim
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
Nope still can't. They must be a registrable breed (lab/weim is not) and they must be spayed/neutered and I am not getting Willie snipped. They have started allowing mixed breeds to compete in agility and obedience runs but they again must be sterile.

My thing is this; breeders don't like mixed breed dogs because health issues, temperament, etc. Why not let us run anyways and let your well bred dog beat the pants off my mutt? Unless of course (I hope I don't get in trouble for saying this) dogs that AREN'T purebred can be great dogs too?
 
#6 ·
I think the answer to your first questions is that they are American Kennel Club (AKC) licened. I can't speak much to the hunt test part, but field trails are designed to campaign or promote dogs for breeding purposes, and AKC maintains event records.

I'm sorry the person you spoke to at the retreiver club did not welcome you in. I would contact another club or just visit their next event and meet people that will welcome you.

The field trial game is very hard so we tend to lean towards proven breedings, but that is not to say that they have to carry papers to be able to do good work.

One thing to keep in mind is any lab with a pulse can pass a junior hunt test. Get involved, people will help you if you are open minded. Training and handling dogs is very rewarding and who knows you might spend some money on a dog.
 
#8 ·
Tim Carrion said:
The original intent of AKC competitions was the for "the improvement of the breeds". At one time a spayed or neutered pure bred dogs could not be awarded a FT title because they could not improve their breed.
Since that time AKC has relaxed the pure breed rule in some venues but not FTs.

Tim
Click to expand...
The intent was for maintaining the "integrity of the breed" not improvement. One won't hear many long time breeders talking about improving a breed.

As far as improving the breed, we've seen how that's worked out.;-)
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
Discussion starter · #9 ·
walt8@cox.net: The next nearest club is almost 3 hours away so I will be without it looks like. I was actually going to buy a pure bred lab (for $500) pup but opted not to after months and months of research. I could never get past the fact that even if I would have gotten one of those pups the dog might have turned into a bust. I have seen it happen a couple of times to buddys' hunting dogs. Thanks very much for the advice though. I will probably just have to find a person (as opposed to a group) to work with as most people in my area are strict lab guys and as you could read look down on people who don's spend as much as they do on their dogs.
 
#10 ·
Your dog can run in NAHRA HT's...

Just have to get a field test number from the home office first.

Out of curiosity, why are you not having him "snipped"?

Even if you do not want to have him neutered there are the doggie version of vasectomies being done now.

Like mentioned earlier though, if 500 for a dog is too much the doggie games are likely not for you either. 500 dollars might be an average weekend by the time you allow for hotel, travel entry fees etc.... Obviously oppritunities might exist close to home to cut down on it, but this is not a cheap game to play......
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#11 ·
walt8@cox.net said:
I'm sorry you were treated poorly by the club you'd contacted. But just to keep things simple, if money is an issue at all concerning the purchase of the dog, that expense pales in comparison to getting a dog ready to compete in licensed venues.
I trained last summer a few times with a young man that had a mixed breed lab. He was a great training partner and I would be glad to train with him anytime.
Don't give up, look for nicer people.
Walt
Click to expand...
I would agree...look for nicer people.

I know our club's policy is for registered retrievers, but I also know that I've seen a couple guys bring their GSPs and I don't think anybody took issue with that.

AKC has guidelines, but I don't think our club would act rudely. Couldn't join or run hunt tests (I suspect it's an AKC rule) but I gotta believe folks would let you throw ducks for them and run your dog at training sessions.

I wonder what would happen if you just sorta started showing up and helping out. Might even tell folks you've been thinking about getting a retriever, but wanted to hang out before you made such a commitment. By the time they called your bluff (might not even be a bluff) you'll have probably already befriended a few folks and it'll all be a non-issue.
 
#12 ·
agengo02 said:
walt8@cox.net: The next nearest club is almost 3 hours away so I will be without it looks like. I was actually going to buy a pure bred lab (for $500) pup but opted not to after months and months of research. I could never get past the fact that even if I would have gotten one of those pups the dog might have turned into a bust. I have seen it happen a couple of times to buddys' hunting dogs. Thanks very much for the advice though. I will probably just have to find a person (as opposed to a group) to work with as most people in my area are strict lab guys and as you could read look down on people who don's spend as much as they do on their dogs.
Click to expand...

how much is your time worth????


ten bucks an hour times fifty bucks to find out that a dog does/does not have the "goods" gets to 500 as well, and is on the short side of how long it would take to find out. Buying from proven stock increases your odds. therebuy lowering the risk that you wasted time and energy on a dog. Not saying that a pup out of a good litter will always turn out, but the odds are certainly higher then when getting something unknown.
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#13 ·
agengo02 said:
walt8@cox.net: The next nearest club is almost 3 hours away so I will be without it looks like. I was actually going to buy a pure bred lab (for $500) pup but opted not to after months and months of research. I could never get past the fact that even if I would have gotten one of those pups the dog might have turned into a bust. I have seen it happen a couple of times to buddys' hunting dogs. Thanks very much for the advice though. I will probably just have to find a person (as opposed to a group) to work with as most people in my area are strict lab guys and as you could read look down on people who don's spend as much as they do on their dogs.
Click to expand...
That does't sound like the Lab people I know.

They are probably mistaking your pup for a Silver Lab? ;)
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#14 ·
The cheapest part of this game is the purchase of the dog. If I could win and not spend money I would, but the level of competition is such that you have to invest in the very best dog you can. I'm sorry if it comes across that way, but most of us have learned that and even though it may sound harsh it is the way it is. If you got a good dog enjoy him. If you want to play this game, you need to be prepared to spend money.

Good luck to you
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
limiman: Thanks for the info I will start my search there! I am not getting him snipped yet because he is only 8 months and that seems a little young. He has not humped anything yet & his rocket only barely shows up now and then. Also he is an amazing dog and I am possibly thinking about trying to get a pup from him. I know that flies in the face of all breeder's conventional wisdom, but I want to at least have an option for later on down the road. He will be neutered eventually though.

TN_LAB: That thought crossed my mind because he looks like a short haired black lab, but I just wouldn't feel right having to lie my way into a group.
 
#17 ·
I wish you well and hope that you can find someone "nice" out there to help you train your dog... they are out there. I met a woman in elk camp a few years ago that ran a mix breed and a short hair in the "Dock Dogs" game and had a womderful time at that venue. You might want to take a look at that as an alternative to AKC events.
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
#18 ·
Simply put for our club we are a Licensed AKC Retriever Club and we hold HTs and FTs under the rules and regulations of the AKC. If the AKC allows the breed to participate in the event we gladly allow it to participate in official club training days, other wise, sorry. The issue is we were getting people with different breeds/mixed dogs show up at training and taking up valuable training time due to the fact those breeds could not do the setup or some other training issue. As a club we voted to limit the breeds allowed to participate in training to those allowed to enter the events in which we are licensed. Sounds rude, but it's just the way it is with our club.

You might consider trying to locate a NAHRA club? Or local individuals to train with.

Good luck,

Lainee
 
#20 ·
agengo02 said:
walt8@cox.netI was actually going to buy a pure bred lab (for $500) pup but opted not to after months and months of research. I could never get past the fact that even if I would have gotten one of those pups the dog might have turned into a bust. I have seen it happen a couple of times to buddys' hunting dogs.
Click to expand...
This can happen no matter what you choose to do.
 
Save
Reply Quote Like Like
1 - 20 of 55 Posts
About this Discussion
54 Replies
33 Participants
Last post:
gdgnyc
RetrieverTraining.Net - the RTF
posts
1.5M
members
36K
Since
2003
A forum community dedicated to retriever owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about breeding, training, health, behavior, housing, adopting, care, classifieds, and more!
Full Forum Listing
Explore Our Forums
General Retriever Training Forum Event Information AKC Field Trials Equipment, Gear & Miscellaneous Classifieds Training