How is a diversion bird used in a

Tommy Wallace · Feb 18, 2011

Master Hunting test?

Is it thrown while coming in from a mark or is it thrown in with the marks & then pull them off & do other marks.

It has also been explained to me as being thrown, pulling the dog off & running a blind.

Also, please explain poison bird & how it is used. Is poison bird used in a Hunt Test?

Thanks

Tommy

Final Flight Retrievers · Feb 18, 2011

Nikki Malarky said:
Master Hunting test?

Is it thrown while coming in from a mark ......

Click to expand...

Yes diversion bird...does not count as a mark you can handle as needed...

It has also been explained to me as being thrown, pulling the dog off & running a blind.

Click to expand...

that's correct that is a poison bird and if your dog picks up any of the marks before the blind bird you arer DQ on the spot.........

TH · Feb 18, 2011

The diversion bird in AKC Master may only be thrown on the way back from a mark. It can not be thrown on the way to the mark. A diversion bird maybe thrown on the way out to or on the way back from a blind retrieve.

Tony

paul young · Feb 18, 2011

technically, there is no such thing as a poison bird in AKC hunt tests, since the working dog is required to pick up all birds thrown or blinds planted for it.-Paul

Tommy Wallace · Feb 18, 2011

paul young said:
technically, there is no such thing as a poison bird in AKC hunt tests, since the working dog is required to pick up all birds thrown or blinds planted for it.-Paul

So, I would not see a poison bird in a MH test.

Tommy Wallace · Feb 18, 2011

wackemnstackem said:
Nikki Malarky said:

Yes diversion bird...does not count as a mark you can handle as needed...

that's correct that is a poison bird and if your dog picks up any of the marks before the blind bird you arer DQ on the spot.........

Click to expand...

When the Diversion bird is thrown, is when the dog is coming in from a mark or blind & you could toot a come in if need to without being droppped or lower scoring.

Eddie Sullivan · Feb 18, 2011

I ran a master where the poison bird was attached a rod and reeled back to the blind when dog had completed test. SO you can see a true poison bird. Never seen it since though.

Pals · Feb 18, 2011

Nikki Malarky said:
When the Diversion bird is thrown, is when the dog is coming in from a mark or blind & you could toot a come in if need to without being droppped or lower scoring.

Yes; you can blow your whistle, say here(not scream it in an intimidating manner). Just don't let fido pick up that diversion bird while rolling back with the mark or blind bird, or you get to go home early.

I usually dance a jig instead of tootin.

kidding.........

copterdoc · Feb 18, 2011

The word poison, does not appear in the rule book.

They DO use poison birds in Master Hunt Tests.

The closest the rule book comes to talking about poison birds, is under the topic of diversions.

I have no problem with poison birds, but I have a big problem with not covering them in the rule book.

Tommy Wallace · Feb 19, 2011

I found the part on diversions in the rule book. In the last paragraph in chapter 3 on pg. 24.

Once the diversion bird is thrown & the dog comes to your side. Do you then pick up what ever birds that are left out & then get the diversion bird or can you pick up diversion at any time after coming in past it?

copterdoc · Feb 19, 2011

Nikki Malarky said:
..Once the diversion bird is thrown & the dog comes to your side. Do you then pick up what ever birds that are left out & then get the diversion bird or can you pick up diversion at any time after coming in past it?

The diversion bird is not a mark. It is not Judged as a mark. The dog has to pick it up.

The dog is allowed to pick up the marks in any order. But, a poison bird is by definition, a mark that can't be picked up out of order.

That's why it needs to be covered in the rules.

paul young · Feb 19, 2011

a true poison bird is never picked up by the dog. you can get these in a FT.

in AKC HT'S we only have diversion birds which are ALWAYS picked up by the working dog.-Paul

T. Mac · Feb 19, 2011

copterdoc said:
The word poison, does not appear in the rule book.

They DO use poison birds in Master Hunt Tests.

The closest the rule book comes to talking about poison birds, is under the topic of diversions.

I have no problem with poison birds, but I have a big problem with not covering them in the rule book.

The strict definition of a poison bird is that it is a diversion bird that the dog does not pick up. As per AKC Hunt Test rule (below) all diversion birds MUST be retrieved by the working dog, there can be no true poison bird at an AKC hunt test.

Section 24. Diversion Birds and Shots. A diversion
shot is a shot in which no bird is thrown, and shall
only be fired in Senior and Master Tests.
Diversion birds may appear on a blind retrieve
either after the dog has been sent for, or when a dog is
returning from the blind retrieve; however, diversion
birds shall only appear on marks when the dog is returning from a retrieve.
Diversion birds shall always be initiated in front of
the working dog. The diversion bird is not a mark but
constitutes a trainability situation. It is always retrieved
by the working dog. Diversion birds shall be shot or
thrown when the working dog is in a location that it
should be able to see the bird as it goes up into the air
and as it falls.

T. Mac

copterdoc · Feb 19, 2011

Nikki Malarky said:
....Once the diversion bird is thrown & the dog comes to your side. Do you then pick up what ever birds that are left out & then get the diversion bird or can you pick up diversion at any time after coming in past it?

Since the diversion is not a mark, it is not against the rules for the Judges to tell you when it can/must be picked up.

I have never seen that done, but it could happen. Usually, the dog picks up the diversion, immediately after delivering the bird it was a diversion for.

I have also never seen a diversion thrown, while the dog is en-route to a blind. But, they could do that too.

steve schreiner · Feb 19, 2011

copterdoc said:
Since the diversion is not a mark, it is not against the rules for the Judges to tell you when it can/must be picked up.

I have never seen that done, but it could happen. Usually, the dog picks up the diversion, immediately after delivering the bird it was a diversion for.

I have also never seen a diversion thrown, while the dog is en-route to a blind. But, they could do that too.

I have run events where the triple was shot and the judges instructed you to run a blind first....I don't care what you call those 3 birds laying out there but if the dog picks up one before delivering the blind to hand you can pack your bags...

Diversion birds when a dog is in route to a blind has been around since the hunt test game started ...a real life hunting situation...As is the throwing a diversion bird in route to a mark...Now disallowed by AKC....Steve S

Tommy Wallace · Feb 19, 2011

Thanks alot guys for your help.

Glad you included this one with marks & pulling off & doing blind first. Wow I had forgot about that.

Thanks I will work more on that

Thanks

Tommy

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