Testing Judges

rednek · May 26, 2011

Didn't want to hi-jack the other thread,but wanted peoples feedback on testing judges.

Should we make it mandatory to test judges?
I've never been tested,no one has ever even asked me if I've read the current rulebook,I have,I stay up to date,and always review the rulebook before a judging assignment.But I know many judges that haven't read a rulebook in years.

What's your opinion?

Doc E · May 26, 2011

In HRC, the judges are re-tested every two years (after any rulebook changes that may have taken place).

.

David Lo Buono · May 26, 2011

Its a slippery slope

As with anything, religion, law, politics

When something lends itself to indivdual interpretation in this case the set of standards for each stake the level of consistency will vary

BonMallari · May 26, 2011

knowing the rules and being able to set up fair honest tests are two different things..There are enough people at a trial that can cite the rule book chapter and verse, but very few that know how to set up challenging, fair, and safe tests for the stake with which they are assigned

rednek · May 26, 2011

BonMallari said:
knowing the rules and being able to set up fair honest tests are two different things..There are enough people at a trial that can cite the rule book chapter and verse, but very few that know how to set up challenging, fair, and safe tests for the stake with which they are assigned

I agree with this,I try to set up fair tests,challenging tests,but I also know the rulebook,and use it when it comes to judging dogs on those tests,my concern is when dogs get dropped for "minor faults".Our rulebook changed a few years ago to encourage judges to carry as many dogs as possible thru the day.

Roger Perry · May 26, 2011

The AKC requires a first time judge in field trials to pass a rules test. Also if you have not judged for a few years to retake the test. I had to retake the AKC judges test last October so the 2 Qualifyings I judged would show up on my judging report.

Bill Davis · May 26, 2011

Doc E said:
In HRC, the judges are re-tested every two years (after any rulebook changes that may have taken place).

.

3 years

Keith Stroyan · May 26, 2011

BonMallari said:
knowing the rules and being able to set up fair honest tests are two different things..There are enough people at a trial that can cite the rule book chapter and verse, but very few that know how to set up challenging, fair, and safe tests for the stake with which they are assigned

NAHRA now requires a clinic every few years. From what I have seen this spring, it doesn't work.

I know a great trainer who is a horrible judge. I know trainers of modest accomplishments who are good judges.

A good judge should know the rules - that can be "tested" on paper and pencil (or the internet) - but knowing how to set up tests can't. IMHDAO

TN_LAB · May 26, 2011

David Lo Buono said:
Its a slippery slope

As with anything, religion, law, politics

When something lends itself to indivdual interpretation in this case the set of standards for each stake the level of consistency will vary

I agree. Be careful what you wish for. You start adding more hoops, and there'll be some folks that will stop jumping.

Seems several judges have earned a reputation, so I kinda sorta think the system is "working."

Mike Tome · May 26, 2011

Some "book-smart" people have the least common sense. Having said that, I don't think it hurts to have a "refresher" course every few years. The judges that know their business might even learn something. Those that are poor judges might be helped a bit, and if they are not, clubs should make wise decisions in choosing who will judge for them. Incompetent judges shouldn't be invited back and if that's the case, will soon find themselves out of judging assignments.

bjoiner · May 26, 2011

If I remember correctly from when I took the FT test, A LOT of the test related to details about hosting a test rather than judging. It seemed more applicable to the trial secretaries and/or presidents.

Losthwy · May 26, 2011

BonMallari said:
knowing the rules and being able to set up fair honest tests are two different things..

Ditto.
The many of the questions in the AKC test have nothing to do with judging, like the specs for ribbons. Having to retake the test is a waste of time. You don't forget how to judge. That said, if AKC wants have a test, any test; they should scrap the current one and start from scratch and use the info such as what is in the "Retriever Field Trial Judging A manual" as a base.

Margo Ellis · May 26, 2011

Bill Davis said:
3 years

Actually Bill you are half right:

MAINTAINING Judge License you must:

1. Maintain membership in HRC, Inc. and be in good standing with UKC, Inc.

2. Attend an HRC Judge’s/Handler’s Seminar once every three years.

3. Pass a Judge’s test during odd numbered years as new Running Rules go into effect.

HRC judges must take a test on odd number years, this is the year for testing. Seminars every three years or sooner. Some of our judges attend the seminar every year.

honkin · May 26, 2011

Took my test yesterday!

rednek · May 26, 2011

In my area there's been alot of discussion about "Judging" the past few years,not talking about the ability to set up a test,just about judging dogs.

We all know what each judge is looking for and what each judge will drop you for,you learn about judges after a few years in the game,but when you start it's very frustrating to get dropped for a minor fault.

Hunt'EmUp · May 26, 2011

After Running HRC I'd like to see hunt test setups approved my more people than just the Judges. HRC setups have to be approved by the Judges, a field rep and the hunt test committee. I've seen alot of problems - injuries occur because people weren't aware what was hidden, things which would have been avoided if the host club, who trains there all the time, had looked at the setup. Exp: (Oh you can't run a mark there, there's a under water drain, which someone has stole the marker off that a hard charging dog could get impaled on)
I'd also like to see photocopies of judges books be keep with the club or at least looked over by the club. I can't tell you how many times I've gone up to ask a judge about performance and see nothing in their book, no diagram, no points, just a smiley or blank. Or all 10's or all 0 filled in right before people go to talk to them. Not whining here often times I will go up even after passing to see what I need to work on, it's hard to have an intelligent conversation, when there's nothing written down to discuss. Of course we could always go with what's written down in my book, but that might be slightly skewed

Steve Peacock · May 26, 2011

BonMallari said:
knowing the rules and being able to set up fair honest tests are two different things..There are enough people at a trial that can cite the rule book chapter and verse, but very few that know how to set up challenging, fair, and safe tests for the stake with which they are assigned

But how do set up a fair, honest test WITHIN THE RULES if you do not know the rulebook?

Steve Peacock · May 26, 2011

Margo Ellis said:
Actually Bill you are half right:

MAINTAINING Judge License you must:

1. Maintain membership in HRC, Inc. and be in good standing with UKC, Inc.

2. Attend an HRC Judge’s/Handler’s Seminar once every three years.

3. Pass a Judge’s test during odd numbered years as new Running Rules go into effect.

HRC judges must take a test on odd number years, this is the year for testing. Seminars every three years or sooner. Some of our judges attend the seminar every year.

I try to attend the seminars as often as I can(had one in February and am planning on attending the one in June at the National Meeting), I also re-read the rulebook before EVERY judging assignment and before every test that I am running a dog in.

Thomas D · May 26, 2011

Steve Peacock said:
I try to attend the seminars as often as I can(had one in February and am planning on attending the one in June at the National Meeting), I also re-read the rulebook before EVERY judging assignment and before every test that I am running a dog in.

Has HRC developed a seminar focused on how to set up a test vs rulebook interetations etc?

Cleo Watson · May 27, 2011

Margo Ellis said:
Actually Bill you are half right:

MAINTAINING Judge License you must:

1. Maintain membership in HRC, Inc. and be in good standing with UKC, Inc.

2. Attend an HRC Judge’s/Handler’s Seminar once every three years.

3. Pass a Judge’s test during odd numbered years as new Running Rules go into effect.

HRC judges must take a test on odd number years, this is the year for testing. Seminars every three years or sooner. Some of our judges attend the seminar every year.

PLUS -This is what is required:

To be eligible to Judge in HRC you must be recommended by an Officer of your club, have a Hunters Safety License and take and pass the current Judges Test.

All HRC Judges are required to take a Rulebook Test every TWO YEARS in order to maintain their Judges License status. The purpose of the Judges test is to require those involved in the Judging of HRC Tests to periodically read the entire rulebook and become familiar with new Running Rules changes.

It is an open book test too and one must pass 6 of the 25 questions on the test. If you miss 7 or more questions, I will not tell you the ones you missed and you can retake the test when you feel you can do better. If you fail it again, you must wait 6 months before you can retake the test. YOU HAVE TO READ THE BOOK and remember, SAFETY IS ALWAYS FIRST.

Bill and I grade the tests and pass the results on to Claudene Cooper who issues the Judges License.

Testing Judges

rednek

Doc E

David Lo Buono

BonMallari

rednek

Roger Perry

Bill Davis

Keith Stroyan

TN_LAB

Mike Tome

bjoiner

Losthwy

Margo Ellis

honkin

rednek

Hunt'EmUp

Steve Peacock

Steve Peacock

Thomas D

Cleo Watson

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