Obedience Class Opinions

Randy Carmichael · Aug 26, 2011

OK, a search surprisingly didn't turn up a lot of discussion along this line so here goes...

What do you more experienced folks think about public obedience classes for pups?

My 5 month old BLF is doing real well in basics with yard work and short marks. We're keeping the enthusiasm up for the retrieving while starting to turn up the pressure slowly on the obedience stuff. Viewing Mertens, Aycock & Farmer, and Lardy so the library is full of good advice in regards to programs, which we intend to follow. I'm real pleased with the way she responds to Sit, Here, and even Heel is getting better with a little stick pressure. I want to be ready to start FF after teething is done in a couple months.

The only reason I've wondered about classes is for the group environment and the obvious distractions it provides. Even though she does well with basic OB in a one-on-one controlled situation, the obvious challenge with a young pup comes when she gets around other people and other strange dogs.
I've kind of dismissed the idea of public classes as primarily populated by housepets and first time pet owners, but I'm now wondering if the simple exposure to crowds like that will be helpful in the socialization process?

What do you think? Thanks for your opinions.

FOM · Aug 26, 2011

I think they are wonderful for our dogs - they have to learn how to deal with other breeds of dogs, especially the ankle biters.

I would say you need to go into the class with an open mind and I would refrain from mentioning the fact you plan to use a e-collar (assumption on my part that you are). Don't be surprised if it is a "clicker" class - if you don't want to use a clicker then let the instructor know, but also don't be a PITA about it with the instructors and/or other owners.

I normally take all our young pups through a OB class, mostly for socialization and to work on OB with other distractions.

FOM

troy schwab · Aug 26, 2011

FOM said:
I think they are wonderful for our dogs - they have to learn how to deal with other breeds of dogs, especially the ankle biters.

I would say you need to go into the class with an open mind and I would refrain from mentioning the fact you plan to use a e-collar (assumption on my part that you are). Don't be surprised if it is a "clicker" class - if you don't want to use a clicker then let the instructor know, but also don't be a PITA about it with the instructors and/or other owners.

I normally take all our young pups through a OB class, mostly for socialization and to work on OB with other distractions.

FOM

I agree completely......

Furball · Aug 26, 2011

Hi! Obedience classes are great but be prepared to conform to the instructor's standards -- which probably means no heeling stick or ecollar. There are a lot of nice trainers in your area though.
If you are happy with your training progress at home, though, perhaps you just need to take it on the road in train your own way in different places? PetSmart, the park, parking lots, etc.
Best of luck.

Donna Kerr · Aug 26, 2011

I’ve taken my boy Scrub through public OB classes. Started with socialization and now we are in Novice and going for our CD. I just started the new pup in beginners too. I think they are great. Scrub LOVES going to class. The only real issue I have had is the front sit in formal OB versus the return to heel sit you want in field work. He comes in crooked more often than I would like.
Remember to keep an open mind if you go and be prepared to treat. The clubs I go to are not doing clicker training but it is a lot of treat training. Take what you need and leave what you don’t like or agree with, simple as that. I did all of my reinforcing of commands outside of class as you do get Joe public that doesn’t understand a lot of the tools that we use. But are dogs need to learn how to behave without an e-collar on, without a heeling stick, with a lot of distractions and a public OB class can do that.

FOM · Aug 26, 2011

I'll throw this out too - every class I've been to, I've explained to them that I do not want to do a front finish because my chosen sport does not require it and all have understood. Just like "watch" I don't do it when at heel, but will if they are sitting in front of me...just don't make a big deal of the differences and go with the flow - and treat training at this age is when it is appropriate in my humble opinion, nothing wrong with a little baiting, just got to know that it is not a long term solution, but it is great for teaching a puppy/young dog.....heck I'm teaching my 7 year old a new trick with treats...he is day two into it and failing miserably! hahahahaha

FOM

Illinois Bob · Aug 26, 2011

I'll do that with every dog from here on out.I think it helps alot.My last one I started him in formal classes when he was about 10 months old.I wished that I did it sooner.The one I have now has been in obedience classes all along since 8 weeks old.She is now around 14 months and still goes.She trains in the open classes now.I might try to get her a CD this fall just because I've never done it before.She has missed the last couple of weeks with her injury though.As far as training conflicts with OB and field training I just make sure that the instructors know what you are trying to train for and I don't do things in the classes that you think might conflict with the field training.You will see alot of treat training and some different commands you will never need.I haven't had any problems with anybody if there is an e-collar but I imagine a heeling stick might freak some them out if I tried that.They train with alot of distractions but still won't let me bring ducks,wingers, and guns into the class.It is a different crowd.

Hunt'EmUp · Aug 26, 2011

I think it depends on the class and what method they'll be using. You may have to adapt the program for your own uses. Hard core OB can take a lot out of a dog you want for hunting. Most classes are designed to make dogs become more concerned with you, and staying close to you, rather than go out and find the birds, they're taught to ignore scents, they teach that go around and sit thing, and the sit in front thing, which becomes a pain for lining a dog on marks, later. Also most public classes are entirely on leash, when off-leash work is the most important, for our dogs. I'm not saying OB classes are a bad thing, you'll get a lot of socialization, and start a foundation for working with your dog. Just be sure to remember your Ultimate goal, and mix in hunt, retrieve, retrieve, when your teaching. Be sure to talk to the instructor and tell them your goal, discuss how you can adjust the class to help, not hinder, later field training. If you can find a OB trainer who also works with sporting breed dogs, more's the better.

windycanyon · Aug 26, 2011

Group obed classes are routine here and have been for 16+ yrs. Plenty of dogs have figured out what venue they are playing-- comp obed vs hunt tests. When beginning casting drills, I've always thought it was nice to have a front personally.

Just because we demand eye contact when in the obed ring doesn't mean they do it in the field. In fact, I can guarantee you mine don't give it to me in the field! LOL.

Chris Atkinson · Aug 26, 2011

FOM said:
I'll throw this out too - every class I've been to, I've explained to them that I do not want to do a front finish because my chosen sport does not require it and all have understood. Just like "watch" I don't do it when at heel, but will if they are sitting in front of me...just don't make a big deal of the differences and go with the flow - and treat training at this age is when it is appropriate in my humble opinion, nothing wrong with a little baiting, just got to know that it is not a long term solution, but it is great for teaching a puppy/young dog.....heck I'm teaching my 7 year old a new trick with treats...he is day two into it and failing miserably! hahahahaha

FOM

Lainee, I always avoided the "front finish" until I started my current lab with the Lardy stuff. Would you still avoid front finish with a lab puppy today?

Pleasantpine · Aug 26, 2011

I do compete in Obedience as well as Hunt tests with All my dogs and they know the difference between field training and obedience training. I actually think it helps with field work......I find it helps build the Team work needed for Field work. Also gives us something to do in the winter. I do attention train my dogs and do not find it to be any sort of a problem in the field. Front finishes with attention are very helpful when starting casting and T line.

FOM · Aug 26, 2011

Chris Atkinson said:
Lainee, I always avoided the "front finish" until I started my current lab with the Lardy stuff. Would you still avoid front finish with a lab puppy today?

Yes. I'm thinking down the road, complicated AA setup, coming back from the go-bird, dog needs to come into heel quickly and efficiently, looking out at that money bird....I don't want any lagging and the dog thinking out front is okay to slow down and check things out....Bullet does that and it drives me insane...Ted's dog's, Dr. Ed's dogs and even Angelo's Pick all come smack into the heel position..I don't have to fuss, all I need to do is make sure I'm lined up properly...I can focus more on my job because in my humble opinion the dog already knows his - come to heel and align yourself to me.

Not to say I don't see the benefit of a front finish as it comes to beginning handling training, but I see the T/TT and such as only a minor part of the big picture when I'm looking for an AA dog.

I work on getting focus from a puppy when I start "sit means sit" - as I walk around them, away from them, I make sure they watch me. And then when I introduce the sit whistle they naturally watch me and square up.

It's kind of like the "stand" command, it is nice to have, especially at the Vet's office, but it is not one that I teach right away like they do in many puppy OB classes.

If i was only running HT's I might teach the front finish, but from my personal experience, I want the dog into heel and lined up as cleanly as possible with zero fuss.

Lainee

Edit: I should add, that I never taught Flash a front finish, but I got a wild idea of running him in OB for the fun of it. Of course they require a front finish...so I used "front" as the command and a "upward wave" as my signal to get him to a front finish. He got me my first blue ribbons...even though one day he came in crooked, thank God I remembered to give the "heel" command even though he was pretty much at heel!

Obedience Class Opinions

Randy Carmichael

FOM

troy schwab

Furball

Donna Kerr

FOM

Illinois Bob

Hunt'EmUp

windycanyon

Chris Atkinson

Pleasantpine

FOM

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