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#7 ·
What's the most recent very close breeding of FC-AFC to FC-AFC that threw something good? closer than grandsire etc.
 
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Discussion starter · #8 ·
Angie B said:
I've done closer with very good results. In my book what your doing isn't that close,, but very interesting and worth pursuing...

So spill the beans.....

Angie
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Can't spill the beans just yet, still have an eic result to come back. The male we are thinking of line breeding on has consistantly passed on good drive and very good tainability, these are amature trainer dreams. I know of two breedings (repeat) that are simular but not quite this close that turned out wonderful. This particular male has more than a dozen titled (HRCH,GMHRCH,MH ***) from 2 repeat breedings and three other single breedings. Pups will have 27 titles in a five gen pedigree, about a 50/50 mix on field trials and hunt tests. The stud to this litter was my dog that I sold several years ago and have always wanted a pup from him. His new owner said he is ready for another dog and wants to find him a "girlfriend" and really wants my input on choosing a female, so I have one in mind and just trying to think it through prior to a recomendation to him......decisions,decisions,decisions...........
 
#9 ·
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#11 ·
Ed Hogan said:
Can't spill the beans just yet, still have an eic result to come back. The male we are thinking of line breeding on has consistantly passed on good drive and very good tainability, these are amature trainer dreams. I know of two breedings (repeat) that are simular but not quite this close that turned out wonderful. This particular male has more than a dozen titled (HRCH,GMHRCH,MH ***) from 2 repeat breedings and three other single breedings. Pups will have 27 titles in a five gen pedigree, about a 50/50 mix on field trials and hunt tests. The stud to this litter was my dog that I sold several years ago and have always wanted a pup from him. His new owner said he is ready for another dog and wants to find him a "girlfriend" and really wants my input on choosing a female, so I have one in mind and just trying to think it through prior to a recomendation to him......decisions,decisions,decisions...........
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PM the pedigree to me if you don't mind.. I'd love to take a look...

I've doubled up on more then one dog in a pedigree close and have been very pleased.

Angie
 
#12 ·
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#13 ·
What's the most recent very close breeding of FC-AFC to FC-AFC that threw something good? closer than grandsire etc.

2xNAFC 2xCNAFC FC Ebonstar Lean Mac

FC AFC CFC CAFC DB’s Cracker of Clubmead

Duffglenn’s Sparks Will Fly***

FC AFC Mizpah Miss

2xNAFC 2xCNAFC FC Ebonstar Lean Mac

CFC Waterborne’s Queen Of The Nile

FC AFC Carrolls Black Velvet
 
#14 ·
I like line breeding; I think the offspring tend to be more uniform and predictable. With Chesapeakes there's a much smaller gene pool so the breeding you're proposing is done fairly frequently. While I probably wouldn't intentionally do it, I had an accidental breeding of half siblings (male dug out of his kennel at 15 mos. and got to his half sister) and the pups turned out really well; the one I have (in my avatar) is my best dog.
 
#15 · (Edited)
One close breeding in a pedigree isn't a problem. The problem is it's rarely just done once. If "the sire of the sire become the grand sire on the dam's side" in every generation and 1 sire is used for every 3 dams, you throw the breed off a cliff for the benefit of a single litter.


Bridget Bodine said:
http://breedingbetterdogs.com/pdfFiles/articles/bracketts_fomula.pdf
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http://www.astraean.com/borderwars/2010/12/bracketts-formula-for-failure-1.html
http://www.astraean.com/borderwars/2010/12/bracketts-formula-nothing-special.html
 
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#17 ·
Breck said:
What's the most recent very close breeding of FC-AFC to FC-AFC that threw something good? closer than grandsire etc.
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Here's a few I found (not all recent).

FC AFC CAFC CHENA RIVER CHAVEZ (His Grandsire CNFC CNAFC WALDORF’S HIGH TECH) X CFC CAFC MEADOWCREEK’S AM EXPRESS WCX (Her Sire CNFC CNAFC AWLDORF’S HIGH TECH) = 2XCNFC BIGGUN’S BIG CHILL

NFC AFC FIVE STAR GENERAL PATTON (His Sire 2XNAFC 2XCNAFC FC EBONSTAR LEAN MAC) X CHENA RIVER BURSTING COVEY *** His Sire 2XNAFC 2XCNAFC FC EBONSTAR LEAN MAC) X = AFC PATTON’S MOBY NICK

CFC CARRONADE’S HAMMERTIME MH (His Grandsire FC AFC WEBSHIRE’S HONEST ABE) X HRCH BASIC’S HONEST HOLLY HOOKER MH *** (Her Sire FC AFC WEBSHIRE’S HONEST ABE) = CNAFC CFC FLATLANDS SLEDGEHAMMER

FC AFC HAWKEYE’S CANDLEWOOD SHADOW (His Sire FC AFC WEBSHIRE’S HONEST ABE) X FC CASTLEBAYS HEIR BORNE (Her Grandsire FC AFC WEBSHIRE’S HONEST ABE) = FC CASTLEBAY ABE’S CRANBERRY RUN

FC AFC FORDLAND’S BORED OUT FORD (His Sire 2XNAFC 2XCNAFC FC EBONSTAR LEAN MAC) X FC AFC JB’S SO RUDE (Her Grandsire 2XNAFC 2XCNAFC FC EBONSTAR LEAN MAC) = FC AFC DROVE MY CHEVY TO THE LEVEE, FC AFC MY NAME IS BOCEPHUS, AFC JB’S RUDE ATTITUDE

NAFC FC TRUMARC’S ZIPCODE (His Sire NFC AFC SAN JOAQUIN HONCHO) X 3XNFC AFC CANDLEWOODS TANKS A LOT (Her Grandsire NFC AFC SAN JOAQUIN HONCHO) = FC AFC CANDLEWOODS TEXAS RANGER, FC CANDLEWOOD’S SPRING PEEPERS, AFC CANDLEWOODS TRU GRIT
 
#18 ·
RaeganW said:
One close breeding in a pedigree isn't a problem. The problem is it's rarely just done once. If "the sire of the sire become the grand sire on the dam's side" in every generation and 1 sire is used for every 3 dams, you throw the breed off a cliff for the benefit of a single litter.



http://www.astraean.com/borderwars/2010/12/bracketts-formula-for-failure-1.html
http://www.astraean.com/borderwars/2010/12/bracketts-formula-nothing-special.html
Click to expand...


The danger in breeding dogs is the person making the breeding selections without due diligence......
OF COURSE a tight breeding can go south!! (as can an outcross) And it must be done with care.
 
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#19 ·
I have heard it said that line breedings and inbreeding leads to smaller sized dogs. I have also heard it stated that it takes 2 complete outcrosses to reverse this affect. Does anyone know if there is truth behind these statements? Can someone explain the science behind it if the statements are true?

Thanks
 
#20 ·
kpolley said:
I have heard it said that line breedings and inbreeding leads to smaller sized dogs. I have also heard it stated that it takes 2 complete outcrosses to reverse this affect. Does anyone know if there is truth behind these statements? Can someone explain the science behind it if the statements are true?

Thanks
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Some evidence when line breeding becomes successive over several generations but not generally with even a close line breeding. As an example, I did a line breeding that has produces several promising pups (time will tell), FC Hunter Runs BooBoo x Hardscrabbles Play With My Buns (QAA with AA placements). Pups are now 14 mos. Littermate brothers (Ranger & Pow) are the grandsires and the bitch lines very strong (Buns & Ruby then Hattie & Nicky doubled).


As for size, the pups are typical of the heritage. In fact my male pup is larger than parents or grandparents (somewhat typical of Buns males pups).
 
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