[B-Rod]

I am following Fowl Dawgs and have finished up force fetch and started working on walking fetch. When approaching the bumper he barely goes for the bumper, so I have started jogging to build up his momentum which helped out a lot. I took this approach the three bumper walking fetch and fetch no fetch drill. I have tried to go at it by walking but he won't really go after the bumper. How do I get him to shoot out after the bumper while just walking? Is this even an issue?

 

[BlaineT]

does he walk up to the bumper and pick it up?

 

[captainjack]

What does he do when he is walking at heel and you toss a bumper a few feet in front of him and command fetch? In other words don't have the bumpers laying out in advance.

Have you done any collar conditioning in the same area you are doing walking fetch? What about FF in the same area? Sometimes a new area will improve attitude.

What is your training schedule? Have you been grinding it out with FF sessions for a while? How much marking are you doing? Are you using birds? Are you shooting flyers? Attitude is all important.

 

[Swampbilly]

How do I get him to shoot out after the bumper while just walking? Is this even an issue?

It could be an issue.
To best answer your question to the best of my ability, I'd ask you to ask yourself a question-
Did you, or do you believe that your pup was properly Pressure Conditioned?

Don't get me wrong,... just because your dog isn't lunging to every bumper he sees doesn't mean that he's not been properly FF'd, or that you need to get him back in FF' and overwhelm him with pressure.

Thing is BRod if you're doing a Fetch/No-Fetch drill and there's not much effort from the dog to FETCH the bumper it kinda' makes "leave it" a moot command...he's already "leaving it" ;-)

Can't remember if Stawski goes from the table to the ground or simply starts off on the ground in FF' but if you went from the table directly to the Walking Fetch, it's kinda' sorta' something different to the dog. You're asking the same thing of the dog, but you're asking it on the ground and not on the table.

Maybe reaching down and pinching an ear as you're approaching the first of the 3 bumpers in the line-up may serve as a refresher.

 

[B-Rod]

does he walk up to the bumper and pick it up?

If we are just walking he will pick it up sometimes. If he doesn't pick it up I command fetch and ear pinch.

 

[B-Rod]

Captainjack, if I throw out the bumper he will go after it no problem. It is just with the bumper laying on the ground already that seems to be the issue. I haven't really done much collar conditioning, with fowl dawgs collar conditioning will be my next step after fetch to a pile. Force fetch took a little longer than I would have liked because I had issues of him picking it up off the ground. I have worked hard to make sure he has maintained a good attitude throughout the process.

 

[B-Rod]

Swampbilly, I believe my dog was properly pressure conditioned but I could be wrong. I think it could be an issue of understanding the command. If there is a bumper on the ground in front of him and I command fetch he usually won't grab it, but if there is one on the ground in front of him and I command fetch and ear pinch he will grab it. It seems like it is a matter of the ear pinch or not as to wether he will reach down for the bumper. So I don't know what to make of that.

 

[shawninthesticks]

Not a pro ,but could it be that since you said FF took longer than you expected because he had issues picking it up off the ground , and now issues with walking fetch where the bumper is on the ground
Maybe you didnt take enough time transitioning from hand to ground and now you are seeing the side effects.

 

[GooseDog]

In my amatueur opinion the dog isnt ready to be tested. Every fetch command in the beginning of walking fetch should be met with an ear pinch. Then you can slowly transition into just brushing the ear and the dog will feel like its really avoiding the pressure by performing the command quickly. Persistence will pay off.

 

[jonathon27]

I am following Fowl Dawgs and have finished up force fetch and started working on walking fetch. When approaching the bumper he barely goes for the bumper, so I have started jogging to build up his momentum which helped out a lot. I took this approach the three bumper walking fetch and fetch no fetch drill. I have tried to go at it by walking but he won't really go after the bumper. How do I get him to shoot out after the bumper while just walking? Is this even an issue?

You may could try ear pinch, but while ear pinching hold him back for a couple seconds to build the anxiety that will make him shoot out after the bumper. I am no pro, but I have done this with some success on dogs with lack-a-daisical attitudes about yard work. Also, keep in mind yard work is pretty boring so try to mix it up a bit. Give him some marks, some OB, I will often give them a couple days to a week break in yard work if it seems they hit a wall, I will go work on marks or remote sit/whistle sit. Let us know what works for you.

 

[Duckquilizer]

You may could try ear pinch, but while ear pinching hold him back for a couple seconds to build the anxiety that will make him shoot out after the bumper. I am no pro, but I have done this with some success on dogs with lack-a-daisical attitudes about yard work. Also, keep in mind yard work is pretty boring so try to mix it up a bit. Give him some marks, some OB, I will often give them a couple days to a week break in yard work if it seems they hit a wall, I will go work on marks or remote sit/whistle sit. Let us know what works for you.

This is where I'm interested in, on the table, was pup showing much urgency lunging to the bumper? I like to start giving some restraint while holding the bumper after the dog understands and it reaching pretty quickly for it. Same thing for off of and moving on the table, give some restraint again to create some sense of urgency. Same to the ground. The restraint is not every command, maybe every 3rd or so, AFTER pup understands the pressure.

 

[maxx]

I am not familiar with fowl dogs approach. Does he use restraint at all in ff? I just worked through the issue with my puppy she was doing great with ear pinch and fetching no pinch no fetch.

We got through it with one short session with pinch retraint and then a lot of praise when she complied. Now flys to the bumpers.

With restraint I would command fetch and using the collar I would hold her back as she was reaching for the bumper with continued pressure and slowly let her get the bumper. It wasn't fun that is why I kept it short and gave a lot of praise and we ended with a few pressure free fetches.

 

[JoeOverby]

In my amatueur opinion the dog isnt ready to be tested. Every fetch command in the beginning of walking fetch should be met with an ear pinch. Then you can slowly transition into just brushing the ear and the dog will feel like its really avoiding the pressure by performing the command quickly. Persistence will pay off.

This. I do things a tad differently. I like to have collar fetched the dog before walking fetch so every time I say fetch the dog gets a nick...but its the same premise. He is telling you he won't comply unless you pinch so you pinch...every time...

 

[22899]

If we are just walking he will pick it up sometimes. If he doesn't pick it up I command fetch and ear pinch.

Ok,, I will ask,,, What is his attitude on the next bumper?

What is your action then?

My mistakes was just thinking If I pressure a bunch,, It will really drive the point home,, and MY dog is gonna really get after the bumper..
That was Totally wrong!

You need to use the Ear pinch as a guage to see what the pressure got you. If the response is more snappy on the next bumper,, THATS the time for huge praise... Make it FUN then.. Keep going,, and as soon as you get a lazy response,, then ear pinch again,, and guage what that pinch did on the next bumper ect..

My mistake was just performing the motions,, but not understanding what to look for in the dog.., and not giving PROPER praise.
The desire and drive woill prollyincrease IFn you prais the dog when he has done it right.
It cant be all about pressure if you are expecting a relaxed, confident dog while teaching this step.
Gooser

 

[Buzz]

Do you have anyone near by who is known for doing a good job of basics on dogs?

 

[BlaineT]

This. I do things a tad differently. I like to have collar fetched the dog before walking fetch so every time I say fetch the dog gets a nick....

i thought that was the norm....

at least in my mind it makes more sense to get the collar fetch tool before moving to the yard.

 

[Gunner's Dad]

Just my thoughts, and how i messed up my dog.

Gunner had an issue of wanting to pick up everything in the yard no matter what he was told. so early on, before any formal training, he was taught to never pick things up that were just laying on the ground. As you can imagine when we got to FF and then walking fetch he was a little confused as to what to do with the bumper that was on the ground. If thrown he is a lightening bolt, but if it just sitting there he seems to be saying "you remember that you taught me to never pick those things up right?". He is now much better but it is still taking time and repetition to reinforce that it is ok to pick it up when told to.

I say all of that to say that you might of inadvertantly taught your dog something counterproductive. I just went back to the basics about once a week to cement the lesson that he has learned. I also kept it fun and short, with a lot of praise.

One other thing, and im not sure who has it on the bottom of all their post but it says something to the effect of dont deminish drive with to much disipline.

 

[Wayne Nutt]

I'm not familiar with Fowldogs but I am Lardy. Lardy does not cc until later after simple casting (which is proceded by certain yard work tasks such as fh, ff, walking fetch, stick fetch). Then he does cc after simple casting(which some call minicasting). Then comes back to walking fetch as a refresher then ecollar fetch. Then introduces indirect pressure on simple casting.

I think I remember Lardy saying when a dog is a little slow on walking fetch you can improve by increasing the tempo. I'll have to research that to be sure.

 

[captainjack]

Captainjack, if I throw out the bumper he will go after it no problem. It is just with the bumper laying on the ground already that seems to be the issue. I haven't really done much collar conditioning, with fowl dawgs collar conditioning will be my next step after fetch to a pile. Force fetch took a little longer than I would have liked because I had issues of him picking it up off the ground. I have worked hard to make sure he has maintained a good attitude throughout the process.

Hillman has some video on his blog where he starts his force by dropping the bumper in front. Almost like a retrieve. In fact when Lardy starts stick fetch (after walking fetch) he picks up a bumper w/o stick, discards it in front rather than behind, and sticks on the next fetch.

Back to walking fetch, if the dog has a good attitude overall and truly understands the ear pinch, I'd pinch for every refusal in walking fetch. For those that have the new Lardy TRT, you will notice that his pup really starts to lag. So much so, in fact, that he has to pull the dog, or prevent the dog from stopping as he approaches the next bumper. This takes practice and coordination do that you aren't just dragging the pup to the bumper. I had this with my 13 month old. She really understood the ear pinch so in short order, all it took was a brush of the ear to get her lunging for the bumper to avoid the ear pinch.

 

[22899]

I agree with a Ear pinch for every REFUSAL..

What is Your response when the dog shows a snappy respose without the pressure?
Just dives for the bumper on your fetch command.?

I think that is just as or more important than the pressure. Especially following a previous bumper that required an ear pinch.