[EdA]

I am reasonably certain that those people value their dogs as much as I do mine. What you or I might view as risky may be routine for them with little history of the cataclysmic consequences we might envision. We all put our dogs in some jeopardy every time we say back. I suspect those fellows might be horrified by retriever training in Texas in July but with a lifetime of knowledge of the risks and how to avoid catastrophe I am quite comfortable with it all.

 

[Todd Caswell]

Wonder if they have there Dew Claws

 

[DoubleHaul]

Wonder if they have there Dew Claws

That made me LOL

 

[shawninthesticks]

Wonder if they have there Dew Claws

Only the silver's due.

 

[Erin O'Brien]

I am reasonably certain that those people value their dogs as much as I do mine. What you or I might view as risky may be routine for them with little history of the cataclysmic consequences we might envision. We all put our dogs in some jeopardy every time we say back. I suspect those fellows might be horrified by retriever training in Texas in July but with a lifetime of knowledge of the risks and how to avoid catastrophe I am quite comfortable with it all.

Agreed, if you're running field trials or hunt tests, it isn't risk free. There's a well known field trial trainer that used to guide up in Maine for sea ducks. My dad did many sea duck hunts similar to this one, and he says the dogs deal well with the rocks, its the barnacles that cause the most wear and tear. We didn't have any dogs get injured seriously on the hunts, but we have had two dogs get impaled, one at at a FT and the other training for FTs.

 

[CodyC]

That is a good example of what these dogs are capable of. With that said, no I would not send my dog into that. But that is the way of hunting where they are so it's not out of the norm.


This also settles another common disagreement..... There is a place for these "big labs" in hunting and I think you just watched it. You don't see no 60 pounder doing that.

Guy told me one time that his little dog would run circles around any big dog no matter what the circumstances, he obviously was a little skewed on that statement

 

[Marissa E.]

That is a good example of what these dogs are capable of. With that said, no I would not send my dog into that. But that is the way of hunting where they are so it's not out of the norm.


This also settles another common disagreement..... There is a place for these "big labs" in hunting and I think you just watched it. You don't see no 60 pounder doing that.

Guy told me one time that his little dog would run circles around any big dog no matter what the circumstances, he obviously was a little skewed on that statement

I must have missed the part of the movie where they give the dogs weight.

 

[Bridget Bodine]

I would like to know how you train a dog to deal with getting his head knocked into a boulder and getting knocked out....I fully realize these dogs have been built up to this , but no way in God's little green earth am I gonna watch my dog get pounded into the rocks.
By the way I have NO problem with the waves, just with the rocks. If the were hunting off a beach I would not have a problem

 

[CodyC]

I must have missed the part of the movie where they give the dogs weight.

Since size a weight of labs is apparently a touchy subject, I was clearly stating a point there is a place for a bigger dog. If you were going to do this type of hunting you would need a bigger lab to handle it.

No you didn't see any part of the movie where they stated the dogs weight, but you did see that the dogs they were using were easily over 100 lbs.

I am not a person that says you have to have a big dog, but I do believe there is a time and a place where a bigger dog is more suitable for certain situations. Not trying to rekindle an old thread but there was a heated thread on here about dog size

 

[Bob Mac]

Do not think so. To many things to go wrong.

 

[SjSmith]

That looked brutal, WOW!

Since size a weight of labs is apparently a touchy subject, I was clearly stating a point there is a place for a bigger dog. If you were going to do this type of hunting you would need a bigger lab to handle it.

No you didn't see any part of the movie where they stated the dogs weight, but you did see that the dogs they were using were easily over 100 lbs.

I am not a person that says you have to have a big dog, but I do believe there is a time and a place where a bigger dog is more suitable for certain situations. Not trying to rekindle an old thread but there was a heated thread on here about dog size

I've seen 100# labs that no way in hell could have done that and some 60#, well built, vigorous labs that would probably have little problems with it.
Weight isn't the issue here, I don't think. It's what kind of physical shape the dog is in.

And I'm with whoever said wait til the birds wash ashore.

 

[CodyC]

Who said these 100# dogs I was talking about weren't well built and vigorous.

One of the issues I have found that 95% of people on here when they hear "big labs" automatically think fat and out of shape. I am talking about big muscular well built strong athletes that are in just as good of shape as the little 60 pounders.

But are better equipped for tougher conditions because they are stronger, they have more body mass which equals more retained body heat.

You guys kill me how you continually get so defensive over the subject.

Again, I am not a "big lab" spokes person and I have nothing against smaller dogs, my last dog was petite and she did fine. But I know for a fact that there is a time and a place when a larger dog is better suited for the task at hand. You can't argue that.

 

[jgbenson1]

Time to bring out the Chessie!!!

 

[paul young]

Who said these 100# dogs I was talking about weren't well built and vigorous.

One of the issues I have found that 95% of people on here when they hear "big labs" automatically think fat and out of shape. I am talking about big muscular well built strong athletes that are in just as good of shape as the little 60 pounders.

But are better equipped for tougher conditions because they are stronger, they have more body mass which equals more retained body heat.




Well, I guess you know what you know.

For instance, I know that my now deceased lab, Daisy could do any physical task all day, get up the next morning and do it again. She was 68 pounds, which is at the upper limits of the breed standard for females. Eiders, Scoters and Brant in big surf and 35 degree water were her idea of a great day.-Paul

 

[shawninthesticks]

Who said these 100# dogs I was talking about weren't well built and vigorous.

One of the issues I have found that 95% of people on here when they hear "big labs" automatically think fat and out of shape. I am talking about big muscular well built strong athletes that are in just as good of shape as the little 60 pounders.

But are better equipped for tougher conditions because they are stronger, they have more body mass which equals more retained body heat.

You guys kill me how you continually get so defensive over the subject.

Again, I am not a "big lab" spokes person and I have nothing against smaller dogs, my last dog was petite and she did fine. But I know for a fact that there is a time and a place when a larger dog is better suited for the task at hand. You can't argue that.

I would like to see some factual evidence to back up your theory considering you say "I know for a fact". I have not seen or been able to think of any retrieving situations where a larger sized dog has an distinct advantage over the smaller sizes.(with the exception of being a tad taller while sitting on the line ,running an event to see over obstacles) With the same muscle mass and physical condition IMO a smaller dog has more RPM's with their legs while swimming (shorter, thinner legs offer less resistance and more Revolutions Per Minute, while a larger dogs legs are longer and bigger in diameter which seems that it would slow there RPM's down and cause more resistance in water. Larger does not equal stronger when resistance is the key factor.

I'm not arguing the facts just looking to see them.

 

[CodyC]

Larger dogs have larger feet which displaces more water to make up for the lack of resistance you speak of. A large dog that is in just as good physical condition as a small dog can perform on the same level because you are now comparing apples to apples.

Again, I think you are misunderstanding what I am saying. I am talking about a dog that is at tip top physical condition that carries his/her weight the same way a smaller framed dog would.

The bigger dog is stronger, what part do you not understand about that???
The bigger dog can retain more body heat.
We shoot lots of swans and I have seen first hand where a bigger dog out performed a smaller dog side by side because a wounded swan was able to actually pull the smaller dog through the water. That in itself creates a dangerous situation. Actually had to wade out and call the dog off the swan long enough to shoot it again. My buddies 110 lb lab retrieved the wounded ones from then on and didn't have any issues.

Again, you are making me sound like I am taking something away from smaller framed dogs, I AM NOT. I enjoy all retrievers of all shapes and sizes but common sense would tell you that my statement of "there is a time and a place for a bigger dog" should not be fighting words and thats the way a lot of people are taking it.

My last dog was a small dog, she did great, my new is dog just so happens to be larger, by coincidence and there are definitely things that I have seen first hand that she did better than him at this stage (he's only 10.5 months).

Im not arguing either, Just don't understand why people get so offended by this statement.

 

[DoubleHaul]

The bigger dog is stronger, what part do you not understand about that???

I don't understand where you come up with that. It *could* be stronger or it could not be.

The bigger dog can retain more body heat.

Again, explain. Wouldn't more surface area lead to more heat transfer and actually cause the dog to retain less body heat when immersed in water that is a temperature less than the body tem;? Unless of course you are referring to the extra insulation of fat, but you said you weren't talking about fat dogs.

 

[Renee P.]

A large animal has proportionately more volume than surface area compared to a small animal. So a bigger lab produces more heat than a smaller lab, but has proportionately less surface area to dissipate the heat.

See Bergmann's and Allen's Rule

 

[SWIPER]

I hunt big water, fields and marshes and my dogs retrieve 1000's of birds each year. If this is what you want to call hardcore hunting and hardcore dogs. This falls into the category of egos and stupidity, just like the idiots that drive around town or on the highway with their dogs in the back of their pickup trucks loose and don't think of the consequences until an injury or accident happens. Should have those hunters switch positions with those dogs and see if they would do it again. Not impressive at all !!!

 

[CodyC]

I don't understand where you come up with that. It *could* be stronger or it could not be.


Again, explain. Wouldn't more surface area lead to more heat transfer and actually cause the dog to retain less body heat when immersed in water that is a temperature less than the body tem;? Unless of course you are referring to the extra insulation of fat, but you said you weren't talking about fat dogs.

A bigger dog with the same physical condition is stronger than a smaller dog. Why do you think they have weight classes in boxing? simply because the bigger guys have an advantage over the smaller guys. Pound for pound they might be at the same physical condition as the smaller guy but the bigger guy is more powerful. Why do you think in tractor pulls or truck pulls there are different classes for different sizes???

More body mass retains body heat better. That would be mother nature taking it's course. Why are northern whitetails so much bigger overall than southern whitetails??? Mother nature says these deer live in harsher conditions therefore they need to be bigger overall to withstand the circumstances. Im not talking fatter, Im talking larger overall.

Cone on guys it's one statement. This is getting ridiculous.