How many of you test your breeding stock for prcd-PRA?
Why or why not?
Thanks in advance.
Why or why not?
Thanks in advance.
Question for Golden Retriever breeders
hotel4dogs
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How many of you test your breeding stock for prcd-PRA?
Why or why not?
Thanks in advance.
Why or why not?
Thanks in advance.
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Most test unless the breeding animals are clear by parentage. I think that pra-prcd was around years ago and seemingly gone so no one thought anything about it until three years ago when a dog was tested affected and we all had to go back to worrying about it. Now, there is a good test eventhough a bit costly, and it still provides a tool available to make wise breeding decisions. Why not test? I don't know. If a clear is bred to a carrier, the buyers should be aware that they may have a carrier pup and test it down the road should they decide to breed. Carriers should not be thrown out of the breeding pool. We have many wonderful dogs eventhough carriers that still bring huge talent, longevity, health, and personality to the game.
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I test and most breeders I know do as well. The knowledge is good to have whether or not you ever breed your dog. I have a carrier male and clear female. As stated in the previous post, carriers should not be discounted. By doing so you decrease the breeding pool too far and end up with more problems that you started with. Carriers don't exhibit symptoms, so it is not a problem to breed them to a clear and no problem to train them for performance.
Dawn
Dawn
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Taken from GRCA website, much more written there........Thoughts for Consideration Regarding Genetic Testing
It is very likely that all dogs carry several deleterious recessive genes. The prcd-PRA test allows us to see the dogs that carry the prcd-PRA mutation. The test also allows us to breed those carriers responsibly, so that the chance of a PRA-affected puppy is greatly reduced, while gradually reducing the prevalence of the gene in Golden Retrievers. For our breed, this is a first. It is important to remember that “for a dog to have a lasting influence on the breed, it must be an extraordinarily successful individual” and to avoid the knee-jerk reaction of inappropriately removing excellent dogs from the gene pool just because we now have a way to identify their carrier status for this disease. Also, rapid elimination of carriers can narrow the gene pool so that other harmful recessive genes are concentrated, thus potentially causing more harm than good. Therefore, some breeders working with affected lines will choose to breed carriers to normal/clear individual and test the offspring that may be used for breeding while others will only breed normal/clear to normal/clear and will not need to test the offspring. Both approaches are responsible.
It is very likely that all dogs carry several deleterious recessive genes. The prcd-PRA test allows us to see the dogs that carry the prcd-PRA mutation. The test also allows us to breed those carriers responsibly, so that the chance of a PRA-affected puppy is greatly reduced, while gradually reducing the prevalence of the gene in Golden Retrievers. For our breed, this is a first. It is important to remember that “for a dog to have a lasting influence on the breed, it must be an extraordinarily successful individual” and to avoid the knee-jerk reaction of inappropriately removing excellent dogs from the gene pool just because we now have a way to identify their carrier status for this disease. Also, rapid elimination of carriers can narrow the gene pool so that other harmful recessive genes are concentrated, thus potentially causing more harm than good. Therefore, some breeders working with affected lines will choose to breed carriers to normal/clear individual and test the offspring that may be used for breeding while others will only breed normal/clear to normal/clear and will not need to test the offspring. Both approaches are responsible.
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Optigen is offering a 25% discount right now, the test is normally $195 (plus the cost to have your vet draw the blood and ship it), so I was curious what the golden breeders thought of it. From what I've read on the GRCA website, it's pretty rare in goldens so I wasn't sure which way to head. I've only had one bitch's owner inquire about his PRA status, but her bitch is clear so it wasn't a real issue anyway.
Thanks for the comments.
Thanks for the comments.
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If I am breeding a dog, I would want to test for all that I could to prevent passing along a genetic problem. Therefore, I test for PRA. It's out there among our breed, so why not test. Hips/Elbows/Heart/Eye. There are many clinics where you can have the test done a little more reasonable. Check out this site: http://www.goldendna.com/
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thanks for the link, Peg, that's a great site.
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I test for the hips/elbows,eyes,heart/pra-prcd If not by parentage.
To my knowledge pra-prcd IS the only test that tells me the true genetics.
Let me explain
By doing pennhip or OFA we are only seeing the phenotypic results.
Elbows we only have OFA(x-rays) to rely on again only the phenotypic results are available.
Eyes are looked at by Eye Specialists again only phenotypic results.
Heart(Cardiologist) the same.....................
Same day I hope science will allow us as breeders to look genotypically at our Goldens for testing. To be better breeders.
Just think no more rumors or mudslinging.;-)
Sue
Choctaw Kennels
Goldens Since 1985
To my knowledge pra-prcd IS the only test that tells me the true genetics.
Let me explain
By doing pennhip or OFA we are only seeing the phenotypic results.
Elbows we only have OFA(x-rays) to rely on again only the phenotypic results are available.
Eyes are looked at by Eye Specialists again only phenotypic results.
Heart(Cardiologist) the same.....................
Same day I hope science will allow us as breeders to look genotypically at our Goldens for testing. To be better breeders.
Just think no more rumors or mudslinging.;-)
Sue
Choctaw Kennels
Goldens Since 1985
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I have only bred my girl who is cleared by parentage. I will only use stud dogs that have been tested or cleared by parentage. Not that I wouldn't use a stud dog that is a carrier but I think that the information is important to know and pass on to anyone that buys a puppy from me even though all my puppies are sold with limited registration. I have an option for full registration and would not give it until all of the appropriate testing is done.
G
Guest
·Remember folks that we currently only have a DNA test for prcd-PRA but from what I understand, Optigen should have a DNA test for PRA some time next year.
And yes, we test all our breeding stock for the prcd-PRA gene unless clear by parentage. And FWIW, I have recently bred to two stud dogs who are Carriers because I feel they are excellent representatives of the breed.
From what I have witnessed, the prcd-PRA gene has surfaced more prevalently in the field lines. What the show lines are getting hit with is PU (pigmentary uveitis).
http://www.grca.org/health/uveitis.html
This disease not only causes blindness but can also be very painful. There is currently a study underway which will hopefully identify a gene for this.
BTW my above statement about field and show lines is a generalization. Of course there may be exceptions.
And yes, we test all our breeding stock for the prcd-PRA gene unless clear by parentage. And FWIW, I have recently bred to two stud dogs who are Carriers because I feel they are excellent representatives of the breed.
From what I have witnessed, the prcd-PRA gene has surfaced more prevalently in the field lines. What the show lines are getting hit with is PU (pigmentary uveitis).
http://www.grca.org/health/uveitis.html
This disease not only causes blindness but can also be very painful. There is currently a study underway which will hopefully identify a gene for this.
BTW my above statement about field and show lines is a generalization. Of course there may be exceptions.
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Yes, and we have been known to ask someone to test as well.
I tested Whistler when this first surfaced and was laughed at by another breeder, until I sent her the pedigrees of his relatives that were carriers.
He was clear.
I don't really care if my next puppy is clear or a carrier, I just want a healthy dog that retrieves, and I will test him AFTER he clears everything else (this is a puppy that does not exist, may not have been bred, and I may not get, might switch to collies) as this is an expensive test.
I would not buy a puppy that has no history of parents/ grandparents being tested.
I am still on the fence as to why we don't have more affected dogs, but until there is more info, I will want to know where my dogs stand.
I tested Whistler when this first surfaced and was laughed at by another breeder, until I sent her the pedigrees of his relatives that were carriers.
He was clear.
I don't really care if my next puppy is clear or a carrier, I just want a healthy dog that retrieves, and I will test him AFTER he clears everything else (this is a puppy that does not exist, may not have been bred, and I may not get, might switch to collies) as this is an expensive test.
I would not buy a puppy that has no history of parents/ grandparents being tested.
I am still on the fence as to why we don't have more affected dogs, but until there is more info, I will want to know where my dogs stand.
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I'm hoping you don't ;-).
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I love Collies.
They not much for hunting though;-)
My next dog down the line is either a Peake or a Collie.
Sue
They not much for hunting though;-)
My next dog down the line is either a Peake or a Collie.
Sue
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collies are prone to some very serious eye problems, much more so than goldens, I believe.
(could be wrong, just going by what a friend of mine who has collies told me)
(could be wrong, just going by what a friend of mine who has collies told me)
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Test and make results public. We owe it to the breed. I know that some dishonest/disreputable breeders want to keep bad info quiet.
It's not a death sentence. It's just a piece of the puzzle. Understanding as much of a dog's strengths and weaknesses helps in making sound breeding choices.
No such thing as a genetically perfect dog!
John
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You can also do the swab test on your own which does not require a vet or a blood sample. You just have to print out the forms and buy a huge box of swabs. I couldn't seem to find them in smaller quantities. Anyone need any swabs?
It is my understanding that "clear by parentage" only works for one generation. So, I did test Trek even though he is clear by parentage so that any puppies he might sire would be clear by parentage as long as the bitch has also tested clear. Testing a dog whose parents have both tested clear is only $95. You just need to send in the form, the swabs, and copies of the Optigen clearance for both sire and dam. The process is all on the Optigen website. Might be overkill, but I didn't want anyone to be wondering.
Maybe Gerry Clinchy could offer more advice on this issue.
It is my understanding that "clear by parentage" only works for one generation. So, I did test Trek even though he is clear by parentage so that any puppies he might sire would be clear by parentage as long as the bitch has also tested clear. Testing a dog whose parents have both tested clear is only $95. You just need to send in the form, the swabs, and copies of the Optigen clearance for both sire and dam. The process is all on the Optigen website. Might be overkill, but I didn't want anyone to be wondering.
Maybe Gerry Clinchy could offer more advice on this issue.
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Clear by parentage is clear by parentage no matter how many generations you go. There is no way that a pup from numerous generation of clear to clear would be a carrier or affected.
And Optigen has never had a pup from a cleared by parentage breeding then tested come back as either a carrier or affected.
If a pup ever did. I would be doing a DNA on the tested sire and dam because you can bet there has been sloppy breeding practices going on.
And Optigen has never had a pup from a cleared by parentage breeding then tested come back as either a carrier or affected.
If a pup ever did. I would be doing a DNA on the tested sire and dam because you can bet there has been sloppy breeding practices going on.
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thanks Judy, I went to Optigen's website and see you can use the cheek swabs, I wasn't aware of that.
Then I went to AKC's website and ordered 4 free DNA collection kits (you can order up to 4 for free). Those are the really good cheek brushes, and the price was right!
Then I went to AKC's website and ordered 4 free DNA collection kits (you can order up to 4 for free). Those are the really good cheek brushes, and the price was right!
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Animal Health Trust in Britain has just made available their test for GR-PRA1 (aka European PRA) back in November. I believe this is the test Optigen will be offering here in the new year. But in the meantime it is possible to do this test through AHT. It is 40Pounds for nonEU residents.
http://www.aht.org.uk/genetics_tests.html#canine
https://secure.ahtdnatesting.co.uk/documents/versions/35_uv8cYt23.pdf
http://www.aht.org.uk/genetics_tests.html#canine
https://secure.ahtdnatesting.co.uk/documents/versions/35_uv8cYt23.pdf
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Shelley, do you know if it also tests for the prcd-PRA? (didn't read the links yet) since I haven't done my boy yet, it might be a better choice for me if so.
Does this mean everyone who has already tested will have to re-test now??
Thanks
Does this mean everyone who has already tested will have to re-test now??
Thanks
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