Most test unless the breeding animals are clear by parentage. I think that pra-prcd was around years ago and seemingly gone so no one thought anything about it until three years ago when a dog was tested affected and we all had to go back to worrying about it. Now, there is a good test eventhough a bit costly, and it still provides a tool available to make wise breeding decisions. Why not test? I don't know. If a clear is bred to a carrier, the buyers should be aware that they may have a carrier pup and test it down the road should they decide to breed. Carriers should not be thrown out of the breeding pool. We have many wonderful dogs eventhough carriers that still bring huge talent, longevity, health, and personality to the game.

 

I test and most breeders I know do as well. The knowledge is good to have whether or not you ever breed your dog. I have a carrier male and clear female. As stated in the previous post, carriers should not be discounted. By doing so you decrease the breeding pool too far and end up with more problems that you started with. Carriers don't exhibit symptoms, so it is not a problem to breed them to a clear and no problem to train them for performance.

Dawn

 

Taken from GRCA website, much more written there........Thoughts for Consideration Regarding Genetic Testing
It is very likely that all dogs carry several deleterious recessive genes. The prcd-PRA test allows us to see the dogs that carry the prcd-PRA mutation. The test also allows us to breed those carriers responsibly, so that the chance of a PRA-affected puppy is greatly reduced, while gradually reducing the prevalence of the gene in Golden Retrievers. For our breed, this is a first. It is important to remember that “for a dog to have a lasting influence on the breed, it must be an extraordinarily successful individual” and to avoid the knee-jerk reaction of inappropriately removing excellent dogs from the gene pool just because we now have a way to identify their carrier status for this disease. Also, rapid elimination of carriers can narrow the gene pool so that other harmful recessive genes are concentrated, thus potentially causing more harm than good. Therefore, some breeders working with affected lines will choose to breed carriers to normal/clear individual and test the offspring that may be used for breeding while others will only breed normal/clear to normal/clear and will not need to test the offspring. Both approaches are responsible.

 

Optigen is offering a 25% discount right now, the test is normally $195 (plus the cost to have your vet draw the blood and ship it), so I was curious what the golden breeders thought of it. From what I've read on the GRCA website, it's pretty rare in goldens so I wasn't sure which way to head. I've only had one bitch's owner inquire about his PRA status, but her bitch is clear so it wasn't a real issue anyway.
Thanks for the comments.

 

If I am breeding a dog, I would want to test for all that I could to prevent passing along a genetic problem. Therefore, I test for PRA. It's out there among our breed, so why not test. Hips/Elbows/Heart/Eye. There are many clinics where you can have the test done a little more reasonable. Check out this site: http://www.goldendna.com/

 

I completely agree. We (my wife and I) feel that we owe it to the breed as well as the new owners to test all that we can. Sure, nature can run its course and a pup "can" come down with some debilitating illness/disease in their life. But why not try our best as reputable breeders to keep the breed as healthy as we can. Just my .02
Kent

 

thanks for the link, Peg, that's a great site.

 

I test for the hips/elbows,eyes,heart/pra-prcd If not by parentage.
To my knowledge pra-prcd IS the only test that tells me the true genetics.
Let me explain
By doing pennhip or OFA we are only seeing the phenotypic results.
Elbows we only have OFA(x-rays) to rely on again only the phenotypic results are available.
Eyes are looked at by Eye Specialists again only phenotypic results.
Heart(Cardiologist) the same.....................
Same day I hope science will allow us as breeders to look genotypically at our Goldens for testing. To be better breeders.
Just think no more rumors or mudslinging.;-)
Sue
Choctaw Kennels
Goldens Since 1985

 

I have only bred my girl who is cleared by parentage. I will only use stud dogs that have been tested or cleared by parentage. Not that I wouldn't use a stud dog that is a carrier but I think that the information is important to know and pass on to anyone that buys a puppy from me even though all my puppies are sold with limited registration. I have an option for full registration and would not give it until all of the appropriate testing is done.

 

Remember folks that we currently only have a DNA test for prcd-PRA but from what I understand, Optigen should have a DNA test for PRA some time next year.

And yes, we test all our breeding stock for the prcd-PRA gene unless clear by parentage. And FWIW, I have recently bred to two stud dogs who are Carriers because I feel they are excellent representatives of the breed.

From what I have witnessed, the prcd-PRA gene has surfaced more prevalently in the field lines. What the show lines are getting hit with is PU (pigmentary uveitis).

http://www.grca.org/health/uveitis.html

This disease not only causes blindness but can also be very painful. There is currently a study underway which will hopefully identify a gene for this.

BTW my above statement about field and show lines is a generalization. Of course there may be exceptions.

 

Yes, and we have been known to ask someone to test as well.
I tested Whistler when this first surfaced and was laughed at by another breeder, until I sent her the pedigrees of his relatives that were carriers.
He was clear.
I don't really care if my next puppy is clear or a carrier, I just want a healthy dog that retrieves, and I will test him AFTER he clears everything else (this is a puppy that does not exist, may not have been bred, and I may not get, might switch to collies) as this is an expensive test.
I would not buy a puppy that has no history of parents/ grandparents being tested.
I am still on the fence as to why we don't have more affected dogs, but until there is more info, I will want to know where my dogs stand.

 

might switch to collies

I'm hoping you don't ;-).

 

I love Collies.
They not much for hunting though;-)
My next dog down the line is either a Peake or a Collie.
Sue

 

collies are prone to some very serious eye problems, much more so than goldens, I believe.
(could be wrong, just going by what a friend of mine who has collies told me)

 

Test and make results public. We owe it to the breed. I know that some dishonest/disreputable breeders want to keep bad info quiet.

It's not a death sentence. It's just a piece of the puzzle. Understanding as much of a dog's strengths and weaknesses helps in making sound breeding choices.

No such thing as a genetically perfect dog!

John

 

You can also do the swab test on your own which does not require a vet or a blood sample. You just have to print out the forms and buy a huge box of swabs. I couldn't seem to find them in smaller quantities. Anyone need any swabs?

It is my understanding that "clear by parentage" only works for one generation. So, I did test Trek even though he is clear by parentage so that any puppies he might sire would be clear by parentage as long as the bitch has also tested clear. Testing a dog whose parents have both tested clear is only $95. You just need to send in the form, the swabs, and copies of the Optigen clearance for both sire and dam. The process is all on the Optigen website. Might be overkill, but I didn't want anyone to be wondering.

Maybe Gerry Clinchy could offer more advice on this issue.

 

thanks Judy, I went to Optigen's website and see you can use the cheek swabs, I wasn't aware of that.
Then I went to AKC's website and ordered 4 free DNA collection kits (you can order up to 4 for free). Those are the really good cheek brushes, and the price was right!

 

Clear by parentage is clear by parentage no matter how many generations you go. There is no way that a pup from numerous generation of clear to clear would be a carrier or affected.

And Optigen has never had a pup from a cleared by parentage breeding then tested come back as either a carrier or affected.

If a pup ever did. I would be doing a DNA on the tested sire and dam because you can bet there has been sloppy breeding practices going on.

 

Animal Health Trust in Britain has just made available their test for GR-PRA1 (aka European PRA) back in November. I believe this is the test Optigen will be offering here in the new year. But in the meantime it is possible to do this test through AHT. It is 40Pounds for nonEU residents.
http://www.aht.org.uk/genetics_tests.html#canine
https://secure.ahtdnatesting.co.uk/documents/versions/35_uv8cYt23.pdf

 

Shelley, do you know if it also tests for the prcd-PRA? (didn't read the links yet) since I haven't done my boy yet, it might be a better choice for me if so.
Does this mean everyone who has already tested will have to re-test now??

Thanks

 

I went and read their site. I'm sorry but I think you could go nuts with this stuff. While I do plan to do optigen's test, my knee jerk reaction is that doing the AHT one for something with such a low incidence (and my dog is not from recent european lines) is getting out of hand. But I'd like to hear other opinions, will everyone else be doing the new test when it becomes available?

 

on another note, Optigen said they would be happy to send me the cheek swabs at no charge. Nice customer service there!

 

FYI, cheek swabs are less reliable and you may end up paying for the test twice if the results from the swab are inconclusive.

 

The cheek swab process is described in great detail, and I suspect it would be easy to make a mistake. I have done the cheek swab on two of my dogs with no problem. I also know of others who have used the cheek swab with no problem. So far I have not run into anyone who has done it who has had a problem. That doesn't mean it can't happen.

 

I have tested over a dozen dogs with cheek swabs, including wiggly pups as young as 8 weeks, and have yet to have Optigen reject any samples. Follow all the guidelines they give you (personally I crate them overnight, no food, no water, no toys, brand new blanket - then I do the swabs the moment I let them out, before they can contaminate themselves) Make sure you rub that swab well in the cheek, don't be wussy! Rather than just brushing the swab back and forth, the way I do is is put the swab in the mouth against the cheek, and use my other hand to kinda hold the swab around the swab from the outside of the mouth, and then twist the swab around and around while I count to 20. Have extra swabs handy, I have snapped a few also if you accidently touch the swab tip yourself or drop it, you will need a fresh swab. I also wear latex surgical gloves while I do this, and if testing more than one dog I switch gloves between dogs.

I buy the sterile swabs at a local medical supply store, I pay 15 cents ea. So, 2 swabs - 30 cents, and about a buck to mail it if I send it regular mail...a far better deal than the $29 blood draw plus $60 courier cost the last time I sent blood to Optigen

 

great idea, thanks for the tip!! I was wondering about the toys, which my dogs share.

I(personally I crate them overnight, no food, no water, no toys, brand new blanket - then I do the swabs the moment I let them out, before they can contaminate themselves)

 

I have had U of M reject an EIC swab sample on a puppy for insufficient quantity and I rubbed longer than it said. I resubmitted and she was clear. For that reason when I did my Optigen samples I did blood because it was too expensive to screw up.

 

Out of curiosity, how did U of M handle the resubmitted sample in terms of payment? Did you have to pay for the second test?

 

I found Optigen very good to deal with. I did swabs on my 2 girls and something weird happened to the the swabs and were not usuable so they let me resend blood samples at no extra charge.
deb

 

so do we need the PRA test or the prcd-PRA test or both? this crap is confusing....I sent in for one...not realizing they were two different tests.

 

In the case you and I were discussing, it's prcd-PRA. Now would it be good if you did the PRA1? Kinda sorta, but it's not as urgent.

 

I think we all owe a big debt of gratitude to Gerry Clinchy for bringing information about prcd/PRA to the forefront. Many persons would not have had either the guts nor the ethics to do this.

I was speaking to a vet who is involved at a high level with the OFA and she feels that we are not seeing the prcd/PRA show up as much in show lines as in field lines because they aren't testing those lines as much. When they have, they have about the same percentage as seen in field lines.

This is apparently true with some of the Lab genetic diseases----the field persons are testing more and show persons don't feel it affects them so not as many get the testing needed. Or maybe they just don't want to know.

Glenda Brown