not every one should get a ribbon.... I am sorry you are an ass ;-)

 

As someone who honored on leave this past weekend, if you have to fall back on "it wasn't that bad" you know why you failed and should just thank the judge and move on. I will occasionally think a judge might have been a bit harsh in their judgement, but if I give them something to be harsh about it's on me - don't screw up and you'll be fine. And in my case this past weekend I spent a bit too much time dry on the water blind and would have judged me the same way.

 

I know when we've done master work, I know when we haven't, I also know when we've been given a gift....for all scenarios I thank the Judges!!!

 

Last year my co-judge and I dropped a dog for switching. The handler decided to wait until we were eating dinner at the club tailgate to call us out to protest. I tried to tell him that we both judged it as a switch but he became very angry and asked what truck i was driving because he wanted to flatten my tires. I kick myself every time I think about it for not writing him up for misconduct. I left after the test and decided I didn't need to deal with people like this anymore until I had to get the judges for our club's test. The lack of judges made me realize that i had to keep judging.

It is extremely important that we all exercise the best Sportsmanship even when You do not agree with the judges call.

 

My first dog and I breezed through AKC Junior and Senior in straight try's, while doing the same in NAHRA. We really never gave the judges any reason to drop us with pretty good marks and blinds. Though we saw some pretty hacky blinds get called back in senior. Then we moved up to Master which was a whole nother level of difficulty over senior, plus they expected smooth, clean work.

I was shocked when I was dropped in my first Master, but I quickly realized that judges had high standards for master quality work, and hacky blinds or other marginal work wasn't going to cut. People feel so entitled nowadays. A Master title is meaningless if judges aren't going to hold dogs to a high standard.

 

I thought "must be an A$$" was quoted in the rules under the judging requirements, somewhere inbtw must have pass at the level; and hunting experience. As long as you fill in the numbers, in all the categories and do the math, you're doing the job and have got a good shield against any complainer. Also learn the art of closing a book really hard, to hint to the handler that he is out and should pick up the dog, so you don't have to watch ugly work go on and on. Get in conference with your co-judge so you can both make such highly obvious . After judging multiple venues, I prefer UKC style where your required to tell a handler they are out as soon as you know. Making them aware that there were issues seems to stop a lot of the grumbling. I don't know what it is but as soon as a handler leaves the line their "work" gets better and better. Thus a lot of handlers are blind-sided after they've been made to wait around for call-backs. I usually try to inform handler as long as my co-judge agrees, or tell the handler that we will have to discuss it, if it's a grey area. I don't like people waiting around for ribbons or the next series if they are obviously out, it's a waste of everyone's time.

I have had the discussion with a few handlers, who's dogs made it through all the series but the math just didn't make the required % in all categories. If I can I try to find them prior to handing out ribbons, nothing sucks as much as thinking you've got a pass and you don't. But it's very hard for them to be overly combative when all the scores are filled out, added up, and both judges concur.

Then of course don't go on the internet to read anything until at least weds. everything will have blown over by then .

 

I really like the idea of judges giving handlers a better idea of where they stand after they run. It would be a lot easier for a new handler running his or her first, second, etc master test to know how they stand when they finish up. Just a "good job" or a "sorry but that will be all we need to see".

 

A Master dog that will not pick up a cripple or live bird is NO MASTER HUNTER and should be dropped. Same with a butt ugly blind. Shot for a Sr last weekend. Had 2 that were not dead. 1 with good legs. NO PROBLEM for either dog.

Some trainers should stick with Juniors.

You are NOT the Ass in your examples.

 

if those people know so much about judging why don't they? I always knew when I failed I got to be a expert at it I thanked the judges and sat on the honor bucket. I always thought I should have had a dunce hat on

 

Well Said!

 

I always tell Flinch WE are lucky I wasnt judging. I always hug the judges if we pass.. I shake their hand if we fail...

 

Respect is becoming a lost virtue, whether or not you agree with those in authority one should at least respect their position. You should not feel that you need thick skin to judge but I agree that it is an asset,

 

Respect is becoming a lost virtue, whether or not you agree with those in authority one should at least respect their position. ,

I concur with Ed's statement

 

IMO respect is something one earns its not given !!!!! as to what the OP and the rest are referring to IMO is a true lack of sportsmanship, plain and simple.

 

As duly authorized representatives of The American Kennel Club, whose rules you agree to abide by, judges have no need to "earn your respect", they are granted such by their position whether you agree with their decision or not.

 

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As a judge you need to respect the handlers and the event. For you to comment about handlers (no matter if they were disrespectful or not) who ran under you as you did you aught to be brought up on misconduct charges and should consider not judging again.
.

 

I see judging as kind of a thankless job so not sure if I would want to do it. I would like to think that most judges try to be fair and equitable in judging dogs. Bottom line is I wouldn't want to title a dog with a meaningless title, Junior, Senior, or Master. Too much work and expense. I remember reading a post about a judge who bragged about dropping so many dogs. That's as bad as the tire slashing meathead but I'm sure he was the exception.

 

That tire-slashing, sand-bag the judge at the tailgate thing... not cool. The HT committee needs to know about it, whether formally or informally, whether at the time or later. I would bet that this was not the first time this person had made an accusation and/or threat, and will not be the last. Doesn't mean anything MUST be done about it. But the committee should be made aware.

 

IMNTBHO; if'n they're calling you out....................then you must've set up a really fine test!!!

HRC regards!!

 

I believe it was Tom Landry the coach of the Dallas Cowboys who said, "When you make a touchdown, don't act like it is your first time."

The same thing applies here when you fail!

J.O.

 

Ive gotten a ribbon or 2 when i shouldnt have, but have never not gotten one when i thought i should have. Have also picked up before being told to.

 

Just a thought, on the other side of ass. I had a pro with a similar issue to your blind friend (sarcasm rules). We dropped the dog no doubt. The following Tuesday I got a phone call from the pro from way down south whom I had never before heard of. His statement to me went something like this "I apologize for making you judge that dog. I should have called him in after it all went south, many apologies"

Breck, I feel your comments are way off base. No names or event names given.

 

Considering the topic is HT,,and it talked about PASSING...

A test has 35 dogs. It is the upper level.. The Majority of the field already has the title of the level you all are running. MANY experienced handlers and Pro's.

At the end.... Only 3 dogs pass.... You are one of them.. How do you feel about the Pass?

 

Now that you thought about it a bit....

A few days later,, you over hear the One of the judges boasting.... Man ,,, My test really ate some dogs....


How do you feel about the pass ??...

We all know,, NONE of our passes are perfect,,because JUDGING is subjective by Nature..

 

Now that you thought about it a bit....

A few days later,, you over hear the One of the judges boasting.... Man ,,, My test really ate some dogs....

I once heard a judge (using that term very loosely in this particular case) remark after judging a mid level HRC event that his test "really ate them up." I happened to be judging that weekend also in the Finished stake.
I did not think that much of him as a judge to begin with and my opinion was set in stone after that remark. It does not take a college degree to trick and fool a bunch of intermediate level dogs at a test. He owns a pretty nice dog that a reasonably successful HT pro trains for him. He judges a lot because he will say YES when asked. Lots of things wrong with this whole picture.
BTW, this guy is somewhat slight in stature and definitely suffers from "little man syndrome".

Judge shopping regards,
MP

 

The crying and belly aching, especially at the lower stakes, is a big reason why I don't want to judge HT's anymore.

 

I guess I'm an odd duck, I tend to give everyone respect until they prove otherwise, once they loose that, I will respect a position/office they may hold, but the person will always be questionable.

FOM

 

That must make me an odd duck to because I feel the same way. I have a strong respect for the touch job that judges have but there is one judge I will never run under again.

 

Solution to this issue. Keep a list of judges you will Not run under again. If your list is longer than a couple then look in the mirror.

 

Judges deserve respect for giving up their time so that you can have the enjoyment of running your dog in a test. If your not having fun chances are it's becuase either your dog is not prepared for the test, is having an off day, or because the handler lacks the experience to know the expectations of a MH test. The stake is called master, the highest level in the program, the expectations are to show true refinement and even then 50% or less will pass the day. Both dogs in the OP description should have not been called back....period, and the reason is lack of preparedness, the reason the handlers complained is lack of understanding.