Not sure but I would like to know as well

 

We pick up the spent shells from the primer loads at HRC hunts and reload the primer with winchester primers. Cheap to train with. Same primers that go in the training pistols. Primer loads will not explode at the end like popper loads so can be reused several times as long as someone does not step on them and crush the ends.

 

Karen - I used to make reloads with my cousin's husband by picking up spent hulls, resizing the brass, and then reloading. It's not a big deal. We'd typically get like 6-7 reloads out of each hull. The same can be done with shotgun blanks but in theory you'll need to substitute the shot with something else. The big question is, what is the something else? So I have to ask again, has anyone done this before?

David

 

So loading primer only shells is just fine? I reload steel duck loads and was wanting to load some primer only for training.

 

http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50482

 

http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/showthread.php?t=50482

Savage - thanks for that. I guess I now have another question. I thought a popper was basically a shotgun shell with a primer only, yet that post speaks as if a popper is a blank shotgun load. What's the true definition of a popper? Thanks!

David

 

A popper that is used in AKC events is a live load (primer and powder) with some kind of buffer instead of shot and a wad. If you put your hand at the end of the barrel it will blow it Oh-F-F - OFF. I think UKC uses something else?

 

There are popper loads that are a blank shotgun shell, and there are empty shotgun shells with just a primer in them. I don't know what you call them. They aren't very loud and I think people use them to shoot at the line in some hunt test venues.

There was a thread here about the "filler" you put in to make the loud poppers. I think they use millet.

At close range the millet is pretty dangerous. Nearly all poppers are.

We use pistols that shoot a 209 primer or a .22 blank, as most people do. They are loud enough and a lot less trouble.

We use a popper gun occasionally and just buy the commercially made poppers. Fiocci and Kents are more reasonably priced than Winchester. Dogs Afield used to have poppers that were their brand but I don't think they do anymore. There is another place that makes them but you have to buy them by the case. Don't remember their name.

 

"Popper": A very loud shell with a crimped end, filler, powder and primer used in the FIELD at AKC HT's and FT's.

"Primer Popper": An open ended shell (as loaded at the factory) with only a primer, used at the LINE in HRC HT's.

 

I make primer poppers all the time. They are about the same volume as the HRC poppers. I use Noble Sport primers just cause I've got about 3000 of them, and crimp the end so it looks like a regular shell. On the last stage, you have to limit the pull length of the handle to keep the crimp from going completely inverted. A bit inverted is ok, because when you fire it, it will unfold the crimps so the deprimer punch will go back in. I always use trash hulls that aren't fit for reloading hot shells.

As others have said, once you add any kind of media to increase the noise, you then have a live load. Even flour would be very dangerous at a close range.

 

An employee at the Hoffman Estates Cabela's today told me that they used to use oatmeal in place of the shot.... I guess it would be no different than using millet.

No, I didn't get the reloader yet. Saving my Cabela's points. (We stopped there after bringing the kids to Lego Land. Which I thought was kinda cool, too.)

oatmeal would be VERY different....it would retain a lot more moisture, if not crimped properly...the millet is more like a seed

 

All you need to do is take your Trap Skeet or sporting clays load and go to 1/8 larger bar and add white millet instead of lead and presto, you have a popper. Just remember you can kill a muskrat with these loads. BE CAREFUL!!!!!!!!!!

 

A good popper load uses 15 to 18 grains of Red Dot powder with a cheddite primer. Add 1 1/8 wad and fill it with med grain rice. Makes a good bang that dogs will here over 400 yds!
I use a Mec 600 junior and load around 75 rounds in a hour. Cost 1000 Cheddite primers $24 dollars. a bag of rice $ 1.50 Wads 500 bag around $7.00 Powder $21.00 a pound but cheaper if you buy 4lb container. Hope this helps!
Warren Price

 

Don't know the details, as I'm not the one who reloads, but my husband makes them for me with cream of wheat.

 

500 rounds per hour with a progressive loader. I would never use anything but millet. oatmeal doesnt plant anything!!!!!!!!!

 

I use cream of wheat to fire form wildcat idle brass with a low charge of Red Dot....Seems you could o the same her but as Hairy Dog stated....They cn be deadly at that point.

Bruz

 

I've mentioned this before...

If you're loading "something" into a shell to make it go boom. It's a projectile that you have to be careful with, as careful as if it were a live round.

It would be just as easy to use cheap live rounds and be careful with them...

If you have some kind of lead restriction then that's another story. There are relatively cheap steel loads.

I will admit that live rounds could be hazardous at a longer distance.

 

Take a primered only hull,, and blank range fire it at a cardboard box.
Ya gotta be careful with anything that goes boom!!

Gooser

 

I reload the rolled 12 gauge shells that you get as primer loads. I use a 20gauge loader to pop the old primer out and put the new one in. There is no reason to put anything in the shell other than a new primer.

 

The difference between a primed hull and a popper round is HUGE!!!!!!

 

Does it sound like a field trial popper at 400 yards?

 

Nope not as loud but I see no point in wasting your hearing and the dogs during training. Plus if you use a primer only load 95% of the time then mix in a popper once in a while you will have a chance of getting a correction in.

 

Didnt you ever hear of hearing protection ? Windy day with primers @ 100 plus yards is absolutly useless. Now lets go 300 yards, what do ya hear, NOTHING. remember we run INTO the wind!!!!! I will NEVER use a primer load.

 

My Grandad used rock salt. Good for trespassers also ,when they are running away you you blast their fanny. They remember after that. They cant sit.

 

300 hundred yards out the dog doesn't hear a 209 primer going off if there is a little wind.

 

Don't mean to hijack this thread but I bought the
Thunder 100 shotgun simulator.(my coolest new toy).
This thing is the Sh*t,no more poppers,an $8.00 can of
Map gas gets you about 750 big Booms. It is safe and
transports easily. The price $400.00 is a little steep
but at $13.00 a box for poppers it pays for itself rather
quickly. IMHO, the conveinience and safety make this thing
a no brainer.

Gregg Leonard

 

I hear what you're saying but I'm sure you can reload poppers for approximately 1/2 the price of buying poppers so that makes a big difference to me. Not to mention that I already own the reloader so it's not like I'd have to factor that in.

David

 

To get a louder pop you want to do something to increase the chamber pressure. This can be by loading heavier filler. Grits works and is cheap but, very light. An overshot card can be also utilized to increase to volume of the 'pop.'

You can't really assess the volume of the 'pop' up close. You need to be at a distance and with competing sounds. Volume of the 'pop' is important in training. If your dog is not use to a load 'pop' and then gets one up close that could cause some fear, or added excitement which can lead to undesirable behaviors. Also, if the only loud 'pop' your dog hears is on a flier at a test or trial that will increase the excitement level even more.

Tom

 

Those two avatars are shockingly similar.

 

Why because there are 3 dogs in both of them?

 

For shotgun blanks I have found this method works.

Buy (or find) a brass case for the gauge you want to load as a blank.
Remove the primer
Use this as a die to cut a cylinder of Florist Foam and remove it from the case, pushing it out using a rod through the primer hole. (I usually put an over shot card in the case before cutting the foam because it makes it easier to push the foam out of the case.)
In another, regular case, install a primer, load the normal powder load and then place the foam cylinder into the new case instead of shot.
Compress the foam tightly and STAR CRIMP the shell to avoid using an overshot card.
When fired, the foam will completely disintegrate over a very short distance.

BE EXTREMELY CAREFUM NOT TO POINT THE FIREARM AT ANYONE OR ANYTHING (SUCH AS A DOG) BECAUSE AT SHORT RANGE THE BLANK CAN CAUSE SEVERE INJURY !!!!!!!!!!